Unlike the previous game, where you could be a Free Speech, Slavery, Universal Suffrage, Mercantilism supporting Theocrat, they seem to now have a system where you have to be more consistent in your policies.
Oh, and what used to be classified Barbarian in the previous game are independent City-States now.
Their borders are not recognized, although those of empires proper are.
It's all a dramatically different game, actually, if you look up most of the changes. This is one of the most exciting releases since ever.
This game has been slowly eating away my life since it came out and I am LOVING it.
That said, I did have ECONOMIST RAEG when I saw that the commerce branch was protectionist policies that actually HELP your economy (defying all sense and reasoning). Same with the Order branch where communism gives +5 production. Word of advice: don't read the Civilopedia entries on this stuff, you'll only get more annoyed.
That kinda ticks me off, I'm a Civ IV fanatic but I've been hesistant to get Civ V just because IV has always been enough for me. I'm surprised there's not more economic faux pas in that game considering the prevailing opinions of most of the entertainment industry, but I guess we can just assume these slipups were naivette.
Avatar by me | Contact me if you need artwork or graphic design done for an Austrian/Libertarian/Anarchist purpose.
Are there any events like the civ 4 "inflation has struck your empire. enact a central bank or lose commerce"? Would be h-i-l-a-r-i-o-u-s
This game has been slowly eating away my life since it came out and I am LOVING it. That said, I did have ECONOMIST RAEG when I saw that the commerce branch was protectionist policies that actually HELP your economy (defying all sense and reasoning). Same with the Order branch where communism gives +5 production. Word of advice: don't read the Civilopedia entries on this stuff, you'll only get more annoyed.
Actually, it makes perfect sense.
In Civilization, very small day-to-day means of living are not represented. The only production shown in cities is state-sponsored production. Communism increases production for the state's purposes (obviously), and protectionism benefits the state's commercial interests in state-run enterprises. Sort of like that.
Communism increases production for the state's purposes (obviously), and protectionism benefits the state's commercial interests in state-run enterprises. Sort of like that.
That's similar to the mechanics of Hearts of Iron 2 (and probably both the sequel and prequel, though I haven't played those), where having a free market leaves you with little or no industrial production available to the state.
Prateel: SOMEONE here hasnt learned about Laffer curves..
"Personally, I see this as another sign that realism is partially killing some of the oddities and fun of gaming. What do you say?"
I agree. It was kind of fun to pick ridiculous sets of civics. When I got bored with the game I edited some game files to make the free market vastly superior to the other economic systems :D
Actually, it makes perfect sense. In Civilization, very small day-to-day means of living are not represented. The only production shown in cities is state-sponsored production. Communism increases production for the state's purposes (obviously), and protectionism benefits the state's commercial interests in state-run enterprises. Sort of like that.
Precisely.
It has to be remembered you play the role of a total dictator. While the various controls may not be good for society as a whole, they can be very good for you.
I really enjoyed Civ IV, but I enjoyed Civ IV: Colonization even more. I can't wait for them to come out with Civ V: Colonization, with hexagonal tiles and all.
Anyway, I wish that adopting Commerce and Liberty helped you more gold and influence and it does now. After all, we can still "rule" our civilizations as private enterprises and not necessarily as states.
To paraphrase Marc Faber: We're all doomed, but that doesn't mean that we can't make money in the process. Rabbi Lapin: "Let's make bricks!" Stephan Kinsella: "Say you and I both want to make a German chocolate cake."
David Sherin: "Personally, I see this as another sign that realism is partially killing some of the oddities and fun of gaming. What do you say?" I agree. It was kind of fun to pick ridiculous sets of civics. When I got bored with the game I edited some game files to make the free market vastly superior to the other economic systems :D
How did you go about doing so?
Interesting. I've been in a real civic strategy bummer since I've been more receptive to anarchic thinking. What is the fun of building a global hegemony in a fictional world when you are trying to dissolve nations in real life?
I'd love to see a game like this based on Austrian economics. You're still a king, and your victory conditions involve all sorts of ego-inflating things such as world domination or building a spaceship or other stuff you find in Civ. But the effects of any policies have a depressing effect on your economy, and if you try to micromanage buildings or technology too much you will eventually lag behind because you can't tax what doesn't exist.
If you just let everything be, you will have a large, advanced, prosperous, happy civilization, but you won't have fulfilled any of your victory conditions.
After you win there's a report saying the human sacrifices of your victory; how many of your own citizens died or were impoverished due to this or that policy. To work it would of course have to be presented with an air of nihilistic humor, but the educational value would still be there.
Mike: I'd love to see a game like this based on Austrian economics. You're still a king, and your victory conditions involve all sorts of ego-inflating things such as world domination or building a spaceship or other stuff you find in Civ. But the effects of any policies have a depressing effect on your economy, and if you try to micromanage buildings or technology too much you will eventually lag behind because you can't tax what doesn't exist. If you just let everything be, you will have a large, advanced, prosperous, happy civilization, but you won't have fulfilled any of your victory conditions. After you win there's a report saying the human sacrifices of your victory; how many of your own citizens died or were impoverished due to this or that policy. To work it would of course have to be presented with an air of nihilistic humor, but the educational value would still be there.
Exactly. People like Hitler lived in a world subject to laws similar to what we find in Austrian School economics, but he was still a dictator. People here often act like making a game like this subject to Austrian School economics would mean that you wouldn't get to be a dictator. But why not? If you want to conquer the world, or commit genocide, Austrian economics certainly wouldn't advise you to "let the market system work"!
If I wrote it more than a few weeks ago, I probably hate it by now.
Really? I always assumed I was just some sort of overarching "Zeitgeist" or "Invisible Hand" that directed society because A. There were no tax rates (I received ALL of the money made in the civilization) and B. I directed things like science, culture, etc. It seems that you have the right of it, though. It would also explains why it takes decades in the early game to create a team of workers: government inefficiency!
Yeah, that was in the Rhyes and Fall mod of Civ IV--I actually have a screenshot of that random event hitting me while playing as the Americans. Really ticked me off. I also hated how Great Depressions would occur in that mod if production exceeded gold. 'Cause, you know, gold has an objective standard of value and prices NEVER adjust based on supply. OBVIOUSLY. The worst part is that it would usually hit me when I was industrializing, building factories, and my production would sky-rocket. I got Great Depressions because I was INDUSTRIALIZING. IT MAKES PERFECT SENSE!
I tried to get that modded out by asking how to do so on the Civfanatics forums. I got yelled at and called various unkind names.
(To actually answer your question, there are no more random events in Civ V)
It's been a long time since I've modded Civ IV but basically everything is controlled by XML files. With the exception of modeling/texturing work for any new things you add, to make a mod is as simple as editing these text files. To edit the Free Market civic for example, edit assets/XML/GameInfo/Civ4CivicInfos.xml. It's under the heading CIVIC_FREE_MARKET.
I havent played it yet, but I'm not too excited about the new system, maybe if they allowed you to switch 'trees' on the fly(maybe suffering through a period of anarchy), but the way I understand the game doesnt allow that option. One thing I loved about Civ IV was the 'civics' system, allowing a great deal of flexibility in how you run your country. I'm not sure if this is an attempt to be more realistic, or to simplify the system(since from what I understand they've simplified a number of other mechanics from the previous games), but I'm not sure how I feel about it.
Although I'm interested to see the new hex maps, and the fact that cities can now defend themselves(so you no longer have to keep soldiers at every one at all times).
I'll probably get it I'm just not sure how I feel about the system.
When you implement communism, your money counter should disappear and be replaced by a window with some angry peasants outside.
^
In States a fresh law is looked upon as a remedy for evil. Instead of themselves altering what is bad, people begin by demanding a law to alter it. ... In short, a law everywhere and for everything!
~Peter Kropotkin
You, Sir, are a prince among men.
I believe I can shed some light on this. Once you choose a civic you keep that civic and the bonuses gained from it in perpetuity (with one exception, which I'll get to). Say, if I was to start the Liberty tree at the beginning of the game, my leader will be called, for example, "Consul Napoleon of France". When you begin unlocking other trees, that name will change. You normally keep the name that you have the most unlocked parts of (for example, if I have five unlocked parts of the Liberty tree but one in Piety, I'm still "Consul Napoleon" rather than "Napeoleon the Pious" even if I did the Piety tree later. If you have the exact same amounts of parts unlocked in two trees, you get the one you chose later (If I were to unlock five in Liberty and five in Commerce later on, I'd switch from "Consul Napoleon" to "Doge Napoleon".
Basically Social Policies still determine what your government is but (as the developers stated) they wanted you to feel more like your civilization was evolving down an organic path rather than switching suddenly between options. Whether this works or not is a subjective value judgment, but I happen to like it. Mainly because the thought of "Doge Washington of America" is just kinda cool.
Seems fine, by Civ standards. Though Victoria 2 would seem to me to be the most market-realistic game.
PS: I love the City-states thing. I’d just hope that one would have the option to ‘free’ one’s own cities into city-states.
Sounds about right. Civfanatics is a very harsh place for Austrian supporters.
I've been playing around with modding in Civ V, and the SDK came out yesterday. If there's any policy changes anyone here would like done, let me know and I'll see what I can throw together. Maybe we can create a full Austrian Economics mod!
I had conquered all the people on my continent, and then I stopped and thought "in real life, I'd be much happier if I didn't waste all those resources killing people who would have traded with me. We could have divided our labor and cooperate, progressing through technology much quicker. But I guess since CIV5 is a zero sum game, and you have to be like born siamese twin frat brothers to have a technology agreement, I did the right thing. Because once I rule the world, I win the game! Then I started building nukes and destroyed about half the world's economy. No wonder:
Civfanatics is a very harsh place for Austrian supporters.
Yea the Civ games have always bugged me, even though I love them and think they are awesomely made strategy games, they give the impression that its the state that is responsible for the source of growth and prosperity of a country, which is obviously not true. I also dont like the idea that warfare is considered a way to 'win' the game.
Although warfare in the series does hinder your ability to move into other, more productive areas of growth(ie buildings and wonders). Its very difficult to engage in war constantly and win a cultural vicotry for example. However making warfare a potental method of victory undermines this message(although I usually avoid going to war when I play Civ).
I loved two for the ease of winning cultural victories. They seemed to shy away from that recently. Never played 4, but I have the Nintendo DS one (Revolutions) that I play all the time. That one you cannot be a peaceful nation, impossible. It also doesn't have Earth as a map, which was a huge disappointment.
Anybody play on Emperor, I am currently on King and finding it hard to make the transition?
I just tend to play on Prince/Noble. The AI getting free cheats is a pet peeve of mine. If I'm beaten by the AI, I want it fair and square. So sorry, can't help you there, Epicurus
I've won twice on emperor, abusing the crappy AI that just suicides stuff into your cannons.
If anyone gets an austrian mod started please ask me for help, I am very interested in that though I dunno what can I do. One idea that I have would be to separate wealth and treasury - the gold you have at your disposal is the treasury, while the cities each have their own wealth to be taxed and transformed into usable treasury. Increasing taxes or production deducts from city wealth; I think thats one key "error" that the civilization series does, conflating the two.
Come on people, what's your Steam ID's!?
This is apparently a Man Talk Forum: No Women Allowed!
Telpeurion's Disliked Person of the Week: David Kramer
"Come on people, what's your Steam ID's!?"
djsherin
I don't have Civ V yet, I mostly just play Counter Strike and Mass Effect lol.
Wait do you have to have Steam to play Civ V?
Ugh, this is looking worse and worse(I hate Steam)....
"Wait do you have to have Steam to play Civ V?"
I don't think so. I'm pretty sure you can buy it as a CD.
The CD's will just have a backup of the game. You still need to have Steam to play.
Taiyama, actually. It's an alias I've had since so long ago I can't even remember how I made it up.
I want to comment in regards to it's new combat system.
Firstly, the system is really great. This Civ V is doing what Halo did with shooters, relying heavily on tactical
strategy over "Horde" strategy, very very fun. ^^
However, I must admit that this new style of combat system no longers feels as epic as the previous Civ games did, to me at least. To me, I loved playing with the "Stack o Deaths"! Sending over 20 units to fight another 20 or over units is the stuff that epics were about (I didn't mind the waiting, I enjoyed seeing the combats, seeing who would win, who would beat who, heheh). And I am the type of guy who adores epics ^^. With Civ V, it no longer feels like that, I feel like Civ's combat scope shrank in that matter, but that's just me, and I can see how seeing long stretches of troops scattered across the map might hit some people's fancies. :)
I am going to miss the epic scale of the combats, but I will still welcome this pleasant change of the 1 unit per tyle deal.
pathos11
To me, I loved playing with the "Stack o Deaths"!
There's a mod out that removes the 1UPT limit. From what I've read, it has a few user interface issues, and I'm not sure if the AI knows how to handle it. Link here: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=380955
Just letting you know, even though you said you like the new change =)
Couldn't add Pathos11.
Add me: Telpeurion
'That said, I did have ECONOMIST RAEG when I saw that the commerce branch was protectionist policies that actually HELP your economy (defying all sense and reasoning). Same with the Order branch where communism gives +5 production. Word of advice: don't read the Civilopedia entries on this stuff, you'll only get more annoyed."
yeah, I felt dirty going full commie / mercantalist. but you do what you gotta do when playing a huge game on immortal.
and I've yet to read the civilopedia...I think I'll keep my eyes away from it.
this strikes me as very odd as alpha centauri was pretty decent when it came to ascribing bonuses to communism, environmentalism, and the free market. it makes you wonder how much he had to do with various aspects of the games.
Bryan Reynolds designed AC.