Newbie here, first post.
I'm aware that the Federal Reserve is a private bank owned by private investors. Is there a definable list of who the investors are? And I'm not talking about the tangled web of member banks, I want names. I've seen some lists but I can never verify the accuracy, but I'll take whatever anyone has to offer.
In conjunction to that, I've tried to find out which investors own the central bank of China and I swear it's a circular reference. My hypothesis is that the same investors who own the Fed also own the central bank of China. My suspicions are that the raping and pillaging of America was intentional and the bankers pulling the strings could care less. They will just migrate from country to country every couple hundred years or so, depriving each continent of all it's resources and all of it's soul.
So who can point me in the direction of facts or the closest thing to them?
I'm aware that the Federal Reserve is a private bank owned by private investors.
There's an error. The Federal reserve is a government agency. The Federal reserve was created by an act of Congress. Members of the Board of Governors are appointed by the President and confirmed by the Senate. The President also appoints, and the Senate approves, the Chairman and Vice Chairman. The Board members receive a salary from the government. Further, the Federal Reserve is subject to Congressional oversight, and all of its profits are turned over to the U.S. Treasury.
faber est suae quisque fortunae
Ah, that's a common mis-perception, friend. The Federal Reserve is NOT a federal agency in any way. It has been granted powers that makes one believe that, but it is indeed a private bank. Do some reading up on the subject and prepare to get angrier at the system.
I'd be much happier if it were a private bank, but alas, it just isn't so. Do some reading yourself. I'm not saying they don't have private employees. That's a given. I'm saying an organization that was created by Congress, gives all of its profits to the Treasury, and whose leaders are appointed by the President, approved by the Senate and draw salaries paid by the government, is a government agency. It looks like goverment, acts like government and smells as badly as government. The USPS is more private.
I have heard the book "The Creature From Jeykel Island" covers this topic. How accurate is it? I couldn't really tell you. I would encourage you to elaborate on your last point a bit. If you know something that the 2nd poster doesn't then please tell. If you make a claim like that then it needs to be more than just a claim. I'm not saying you are wrong. I have heard the same thing said before, but I have never seriously researched it. I have heard that guys like JP Morgan, Rockefeller, agents of the Rothschild banking dynasty had their hands in the Federal Reserve creation. As far as specifics go I have none therefore I can't make as bold a claim as you have.
Rhythmdoctor wrote: Ah, that's a common mis-perception, friend. The Federal Reserve is NOT a federal agency in any way. It has been granted powers that makes one believe that, but it is indeed a private bank. Do some reading up on the subject and prepare to get angrier at the system.
If the FED is a private bank, then Barack Obama is self-employed.
Being granted special powers by the government is exactly what it means to be 'public'. It means to be part of the socialized system.
This is directly from the Federal Reserve website. This is their description of their role in government. They are NOT a government agency and if you truly believe that, I heavily encourage you to dig deeper. Anyways, here's an ambiguous description of their role. If they were truly a federal agency, there would be more clarity on the matter. Come on, guys, this should be common knowledge. Seriously.
The Federal Reserve System is considered to be an independent central bank because its decisions do not have to be ratified by the President or anyone else in the executive branch of government. The System is, however, subject to oversight by the U.S. Congress. The Federal Reserve must work within the framework of the overall objectives of economic and financial policy established by the government; therefore, the description of the System as "independent within the government" is more accurate
It doesn't matter what they write on their website, how transparent it is or who makes which decisions. The only thing that matters is that if you try to compete with them, government agents will bust your door in and drag you to jail. This means the Federal Reserve is a government agency.
Confusingly, both sides are right. The Federal Reserve is a de facto government entity. Nevertheless, the Federal Reserve is a de jure public/private entity. This special legal status grants the Federal Reserve powers that other public entities do not have, most notably, freedom from oversight by Congress beyond those powers of oversight which are explicitly granted to Congress by law. Congress has no power to open the books of Goldman Sachs or any other private individual or corporation. Likewise, it has no power to open the books of the Federal Reserve, and for the same reason... beyond the extent to which law explicitly grants Congress the power to open its books. The Federal Reserve Act is the charter for a nationwide banking cartel, regulated by the Federal Reserve, which is not a de jure department of the United States government even if it is, de facto, a government entity.
Note that the fact that the Federal Reserve is a de facto government entity does not mean it is under the control of the United States government. The chairman of the Federal Reserve is independent and the actions of the Federal Reserve may or may not serve the interests of the United States government but always serve the interests of the Federal Reserve (that is, of its member banks).
Clayton -
The US Federal Reserve is a special legal entity.
It has over 3000 member banks. These banks are organized into territorial districts, each one overseen by one of the 12 Federal Reserve Banks. Member banks hold stocks of one (or more) Federal Reserve Banks, and these stocks give them voting rights for the Board of Directors. Each Federal Reserve Bank (Atlanta, St Louis, San Francisco etc) has a Board of Directors made up of nine members, broken down into three groups of three: A class, B class and C class. A class Directors are elected by member banks and represent the banks themselves; B class Directors are again elected by member banks but are supposed to represent the public: C class Directors are appointed by the Board of Governors of the Federal Reserve. Each elected Director must be approved by the seven member Board of Directors.
The Board of Directors itself is made up by seven members: they are appointed by the President of the United States and approved by the Senate.
The main operating tool of the Federal Reserve system is the Federal Open Market Committee (FOMC): it is the main tool of monetary policy, regulating both operations in foreign exchange markets and domestic monetary policies. It has twelve members: all the seven members of the Board of Directors plus five members of Federal Reserve Banks.
These are news everybody knows and easily accesible on the Internet. The big problem is, as you rightly said, finding out which bank owns how many stocks of each Federal Reserve Bank. There are all sorts of unclear "charts" floating around the Internet, charts of uncertain origins and dubious reliability. For myself, I believe a look at the FOMC is enough: even if all five representitives of the Federal Reserve Banks were to be appointed by the member banks themselves they'd still be a minority. The Board of Governors, presidentially appointed, holds the ultimate voting power in every decision.
As for the People's Bank of China the answer is much simpler. The governor himself is appointed and removed by the President of the Republic. The deputy governors are appointed and removed by the Premier of the State Council. There are no stockholders and the Bank itself answers directly to the National People's Council.
Rhythmdoctor wrote: This is directly from the Federal Reserve website. This is their description of their role in government. They are NOT a government agency and if you truly believe that, I heavily encourage you to dig deeper. Anyways, here's an ambiguous description of their role. If they were truly a federal agency, there would be more clarity on the matter. Come on, guys, this should be common knowledge. Seriously. The Federal Reserve System is considered to be an independent central bank because its decisions do not have to be ratified by the President or anyone else in the executive branch of government. The System is, however, subject to oversight by the U.S. Congress. The Federal Reserve must work within the framework of the overall objectives of economic and financial policy established by the government; therefore, the description of the System as "independent within the government" is more accurate
If you wanted clarity, why didn't you start with the first paragraph of that section? Or highlight the clearer indicatiors in what you did quote? Or continue to the third paragraph?
http://www.federalreserve.gov/generalinfo/faq/faqfrs.htm The Federal Reserve System is not "owned" by anyone and is not a private, profit-making institution. Instead, it is an independent entity within the government, having both public purposes and private aspects. As the nation's central bank, the Federal Reserve derives its authority from the U.S. Congress. It is considered an independent central bank because its decisions do not have to be ratified by the President or anyone else in the executive or legislative branch of government, it does not receive funding appropriated by Congress, and the terms of the members of the Board of Governors span multiple presidential and congressional terms. However, the Federal Reserve is subject to oversight by Congress, which periodically reviews its activities and can alter its responsibilities by statute. Also, the Federal Reserve must work within the framework of the overall objectives of economic and financial policy established by the government. Therefore, the Federal Reserve can be more accurately described as "independent within the government." The twelve regional Federal Reserve Banks, which were established by Congress as the operating arms of the nation's central banking system, are organized much like private corporations--possibly leading to some confusion about "ownership." For example, the Reserve Banks issue shares of stock to member banks. However, owning Reserve Bank stock is quite different from owning stock in a private company. The Reserve Banks are not operated for profit, and ownership of a certain amount of stock is, by law, a condition of membership in the System. The stock may not be sold, traded, or pledged as security for a loan; dividends are, by law, 6 percent per year.
The Federal Reserve System is not "owned" by anyone and is not a private, profit-making institution. Instead, it is an independent entity within the government, having both public purposes and private aspects.
As the nation's central bank, the Federal Reserve derives its authority from the U.S. Congress. It is considered an independent central bank because its decisions do not have to be ratified by the President or anyone else in the executive or legislative branch of government, it does not receive funding appropriated by Congress, and the terms of the members of the Board of Governors span multiple presidential and congressional terms. However, the Federal Reserve is subject to oversight by Congress, which periodically reviews its activities and can alter its responsibilities by statute. Also, the Federal Reserve must work within the framework of the overall objectives of economic and financial policy established by the government. Therefore, the Federal Reserve can be more accurately described as "independent within the government."
The twelve regional Federal Reserve Banks, which were established by Congress as the operating arms of the nation's central banking system, are organized much like private corporations--possibly leading to some confusion about "ownership." For example, the Reserve Banks issue shares of stock to member banks. However, owning Reserve Bank stock is quite different from owning stock in a private company. The Reserve Banks are not operated for profit, and ownership of a certain amount of stock is, by law, a condition of membership in the System. The stock may not be sold, traded, or pledged as security for a loan; dividends are, by law, 6 percent per year.
Paraphrasing the first bolded section: The fact that it is organised like a private coporation leaves people to be confused and think it is a private corporation.
Or you could move down a couple paragraphs:
The intent of Congress in shaping the Federal Reserve Act was to keep politics out of monetary policy. The System is independent of other branches and agencies of government. It is self-financed and therefore is not subject to the congressional budgetary process.
Notice the phrase other branches and agencies of government. This is a clear indication that the Federal Reserve is an agency of govenment.
Clayton wrote: The chairman of the Federal Reserve is independent and the actions of the Federal Reserve may or may not serve the interests of the United States government but always serve the interests of the Federal Reserve (that is, of its member banks).
The chairman of the Federal Reserve is independent and the actions of the Federal Reserve may or may not serve the interests of the United States government but always serve the interests of the Federal Reserve (that is, of its member banks).
The chairman is "independent" of what? He is a federal employee drawing a government salary. By law, the Federal Reserve must serve the interests of the United States governmen, though it's of course debatable if they are effective in doing so.
Ok, just admit you work for the Fed or the IRS. If it's not obvious that the Fed tries to be as ambiguous as possible regarding ownership, then you're on the wrong side of the fight my friend. Everything about the Fed is rotten, including who the investors of the member banks are.
Ok, just admit you work for the Fed or the IRS.
Circumstantial ad hominem otherwise known as Bulverism.
You just bulver'd up, my friend.
LOL, indeed I did. I'm tired today and don't have the energy to argue today.
Everything about the Fed is rotten
You'll get no argument from me on that. It's just what you consider rotten is a bit... off. The reason the Fed is rotton is because it's part of the government. As far as rottenness goes, there is not a single private agency in the world that is even close to govenment.