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Freedom4me may have exposed himself

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John James Posted: Fri, Jan 13 2012 8:54 AM

 

Notice how virtually everything they use comes from "civ"

 

:UPDATE:

So apparently, just like they (in the entertainment world) do with everything else, there's actually more than one show with this exact same premise.  I would ask "what is the world coming to?", but the irony would probably make my head explode.

 

 

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That is probably what most of NH citizenry is like, huh?  Well, they probably don't like to be called "citizens."

 

It's funny that Marx describes this lifestyle in The German Ideology.  W00t for living like Marx envisioned with the mentality of Thoreau.

"The Fed does not make predictions. It makes forecasts..." - Mustang19
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Jargon replied on Thu, Jan 19 2012 12:22 AM

I'd watch that

Land & Liberty

The Anarch is to the Anarchist what the Monarch is to the Monarchist. -Ernst Jünger

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That vid makes survivalists look psychotic. But everything he said is 100% true. We know that our civ won't be here forever so why stay in denial?

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Hunting ain't gonna work after teotwawki, because every forest's gonna have like twenty city-dwellers per square inch looking for food. It's kind of a catch-22: If things go bad to the point where you actually need to live off the land to survive, it's not going to be possible to live off the land, because there's going to be roaming hordes of starving people everywhere. Societal complexity has come to the point where just deleting "the grid" would mean that there won't be food for like 90% of people. Meaning you're unlikely to make it in that scenario regardless of what you do. So it's pointless to even plan for total breakdown. It's more realistic to plan for some bad monetary breakdown great-depression style, possibly with some starvation. In that case you're far better off relying on society than to try to catch your own. I for on am looking to become more specialized to make myself useful in the case of teotwawki, not less.

"They all look upon progressing material improvement as upon a self-acting process." - Ludwig von Mises
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I've laid out my survival plans here. I plan on learning all the survival skills and then leaving civ by moving to the wilderness in NH. I'm learning the skills right now. Realize that off-the-grid-living is the natural state of humans. It's what we evolved to do. It's living in civ which is unnatural and not healthy.

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CrazyCoot replied on Thu, Jan 19 2012 5:29 AM

I plan on making my living by trading in the flesh of poor children.

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Chyd3nius replied on Thu, Jan 19 2012 9:14 AM

Starvation and low amount of nutrition whch people would face if they all would move to the woods is much more unhealthy compared to modern civilization.

-- --- English I not so well sorry I will. I'm not native speaker.
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John James replied on Thu, Jan 19 2012 10:32 AM

Chyd3nius:
Starvation and low amount of nutrition whch people would face if they all would move to the woods is much more unhealthy compared to modern civilization.

aaaand waaait for it...

 

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James replied on Thu, Jan 19 2012 11:53 AM

Is that a genuine hand-crafted, carbon-fiber, dual-cam, compound bow made by the yeomen of the shire?

Are the arrows hewn from mammoth bone?

Non bene pro toto libertas venditur auro
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Clayton replied on Thu, Jan 19 2012 12:16 PM

Yeah, it's a farce. Anti-division-of-labor, anti-civilization attitudes do not lead to greater individual freedom. In fact, the end result is reduced individual freedom. The human struggle from the dawn of humanity can be broadly characterized in terms of the rise out of animal subsistence. In escaping animal subsistence, we became free of the shackles of Nature. She is a dispassionately cruel master but as Francis Bacon said, Nature, when obeyed, may be commanded.

With the rise of capital has also come the rise of systematic parasitism (the State). Only conditions of abundant capital stocks can sustain a predating class. Prior to the rise of capital, there was very little to plunder from the individual besides his productive capacity as a chattel slave. Humanity has not yet flushed the cancer of the predating class but I do believe the day is coming when this will happen.

The way out of the shackles of the State is not to return to the shackles of Nature. It is to dissolve the shackles of the State with the truth; the truth that every human is born free and has nothing to fear from life besides succumbing to the bullying of those who would live at his or her expense. The mental prison in which most people live most of their lives cannot really contain them. It is not so inescapable; it's like chalk drawn on the ground that you are supposed to pretend is a prison fence. To see the chalk for what it is, is to be freed instantly. Simply stand up and walk wherever you like. The elimination of fear and false guilt from your soul is the first and only step to freedom.

Once you break out of the prison, you should considering telling others how they can escape, too. Or just walk around freely and they'll notice you broke out and begin to wonder if they can do it, too. Don't flaunt your freedom in front of the guards or snitches because they will take it personally and make it their personal mission in life to destroy you. Keep a piece of chalk in your pocket so you can quickly sit down and draw a line around yourself whenever a guard walks by.

Freedom, like happiness, is largely a choice. Choose to be free and you are free. There's no need to go weekend warrior, run out into the woods and pretend to be a caveman. Just be free.

Clayton -

http://voluntaryistreader.wordpress.com
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Bert replied on Thu, Jan 19 2012 2:18 PM

F4M probably doesn't realize a lot of the things he supports comes off rather Marxist on the subject of the division of labor.  F4M has the philosophy that every individual should be able to do and own everything they make, that "the fruits of their labor" is soley that persons, and to maximize his individuality is to maximize everything that person has to do for themselves, which means one can't specialize.  This doesn't really free someone to pursue other interests beyond that of merely surviving, especially since F4M has the view that anything that is beyond the individual is a collective, which is evil.

I had always been impressed by the fact that there are a surprising number of individuals who never use their minds if they can avoid it, and an equal number who do use their minds, but in an amazingly stupid way. - Carl Jung, Man and His Symbols
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Bert:
This doesn't really free someone to pursue other interests beyond that of merely surviving

...which I suppose doesn't really matter when "surviving" is all you're interested in.  (Or at least pretend to be.)

 

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Survivalism is about as anti-marxist and anti-statist as you can get. Tell me why there has never been a truly stateless agricultural society yet almost every H/G society was stateless. Thinking that everyone should be self-sufficient doesnt mean rejecting the division of labor. It just means you know everyone has the ability to learn the skills needed to survive on their own. Thats what it means to be an individualist. Being free from the collective is the definition of freedom that makes the most sense. Your not entitled to anything except to be left alone. Thats what we need to base life on.

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Bert replied on Fri, Jan 20 2012 1:39 AM

What if we voluntarily choose to be part of the collective?

The line, "Survivalism is about as anti-marxist and anti-statist as you can get." reminds me of Rand's We the Living.  Yeah, they were definitely surviving.

I had always been impressed by the fact that there are a surprising number of individuals who never use their minds if they can avoid it, and an equal number who do use their minds, but in an amazingly stupid way. - Carl Jung, Man and His Symbols
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What if we voluntarily choose to be part of the collective?

u can be part of the collective all you want just dont involve me in it.

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Freedom4Me73986:
Survivalism is about as anti-marxist and anti-statist as you can get. Tell me why there has never been a truly stateless agricultural society yet almost every H/G society was stateless. Thinking that everyone should be self-sufficient doesnt mean rejecting the division of labor. It just means you know everyone has the ability to learn the skills needed to survive on their own. Thats what it means to be an individualist. Being free from the collective is the definition of freedom that makes the most sense. Your not entitled to anything except to be left alone. Thats what we need to base life on.

Hey!  Since you're obviously not going off to live in the woods yet, how about those links you owe me?

 

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You can't google?

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John James replied on Sat, Jan 21 2012 10:45 PM

Freedom4Me73986:
You can't google?

I can.  But I'm not the one who made the idiotic claim that:

"A TON of polls before the primary had Dr. Paul and Obamney tied at 1st. Some had Dr. Paul ahead by a few points."
- Freedom4Me73986

So I don't have to.  But apparently you can't google, as you haven't provided a single credible one yet.  You've provided

1) a youtube video from an FSP weirdo talking to his webcam.

2) Another youtube video of nothing but graphical text reporting the "results" of some poll allegedly done by some organization which I've never heard of, and for which the only Google references are links to its own site.

3) A link to an article that states the exact opposite of your claim.

4) A link to another article that also states the exact opposite of your claim.

So once again.  "A TON".  You even put it in all caps.  Where are they?  You should have no trouble finding at least 2.  You have yet to show a single credible one, and have even produced two that work against you...and you have the gaul to infer I can't google?

Just two.  That's all I'm asking for.  That's bare minimum.  You said "a TON" (and, again, put it in all caps).  I'm just asking for two.  And "some" implies plural.  More than one.  So give me two that say Paul was in first place by a few points as well.

 

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Is this a game to you?  An online poll?  Are you f-ing serious?

 

 

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gotlucky replied on Sat, Jan 28 2012 4:47 PM

lol, it's the poll where people could vote more than once!

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Why are you so dead-set-against living independently?

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Chyd3nius replied on Mon, Jan 30 2012 2:51 AM

I will repost this.

F4M: As a Free State Project-supporter I must ask, can you please stop posting shit about Free State Project? I ask this again and will ask until you answer: Do you understand that because of you, people in this forum have started to hate FSP? Do you understand that you have hurt Free State Project more than have helped it?

-- --- English I not so well sorry I will. I'm not native speaker.
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No. I was asking what's wrong with wanting to live primitively.

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The women.

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gotlucky replied on Tue, Jan 31 2012 5:16 PM

Well played.

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The women.

????????

So women is what's wrong with rewilding?

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The proper response to HabbaBabba is touché.

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No. I was asking what's wrong with wanting to live primitively.

I don't care what you will do with your life. It's OK to me if you want to live in woods. But can you answer to my questions? Do you want that Free State Project succeeds and more libertarians will move to New Hampshire?

-- --- English I not so well sorry I will. I'm not native speaker.
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Freedom4Me73986:
Why are you so dead-set-against living independently?

What the f-ing hell does that have to do with you producing links to prove your claim about "A TON of polls before the primary had Dr. Paul and Obamney tied at 1st. Some had Dr. Paul ahead by a few points." ?

 

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OK I'm sorry I haven't been able to give you the links you wanted. There was way too much hype around Dr. Paul in NH the weeks before the primary. People were saying he was going to beat Romney b/c of all the independent voters who are mostly young supporters of Dr. Paul.

Can we end this now?

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Bert replied on Mon, Feb 13 2012 12:49 PM

People were saying he was going to beat Romney b/c of all the independent voters who are mostly young supporters of Dr. Paul.

So the tons of polls you claimed were actually "people" and you based it entirely off hearsay?

I had always been impressed by the fact that there are a surprising number of individuals who never use their minds if they can avoid it, and an equal number who do use their minds, but in an amazingly stupid way. - Carl Jung, Man and His Symbols
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Freedom4Me73986:

OK I'm sorry I haven't been able to give you the links you wanted. There was way too much hype around Dr. Paul in NH the weeks before the primary. People were saying he was going to beat Romney b/c of all the independent voters who are mostly young supporters of Dr. Paul.

Can we end this now?

So, basically you're saying you made the whole thing up?

 

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gotlucky replied on Mon, Feb 13 2012 9:41 PM

Oh, you're relentless!  I probably should never make baseless assertions in a discussion with you!

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I would think one should never make baseless assertions period.  But I guess that's just me.

 

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Freedom4Me73986:

OK I'm sorry I haven't been able to give you the links you wanted. There was way too much hype around Dr. Paul in NH the weeks before the primary. People were saying he was going to beat Romney b/c of all the independent voters who are mostly young supporters of Dr. Paul.

Can we end this now?

So, basically you're saying you made the whole thing up?

Not exactly made the whole thing up. There was talk all over NH that Dr. Paul was outperforming Romney in the polls. We were told Dr. Paul could get something like 31% and Romney 29%.

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John James replied on Mon, Feb 13 2012 10:23 PM

"A TON of polls before the primary had Dr. Paul and Obamney tied at 1st. Some had Dr. Paul ahead by a few points."
- Freedom4Me73986

 

That's what you said.  I asked you multiple times for just two of each of these polls, and this is what ensued (after multiple requests, mind you).  And if you'll scroll down a bit from that post, after I listed all that nonsense, you tried one more link to an online poll (from DailyPaul, no less) where people could vote more than once.

And when I articulated this, your response was:

"Why are you so dead-set-against living independently?"

 

That's what you said.  I could not make this up.  It was in this very thread if anyone doesn't believe me.  Scroll up.  We're talking about simply providing a link to poll showing what Freedom4Me73986 said "A TON" [caps original] of polls showed.  I simply asked for some of those links.  And after a bunch of nonsense, the response is "Why are you so dead-set-against living independently?"

And all this after you promised to never post another NH or FSP-related topic on here again...which you have broken at least 4-6 times already.

 

1) Admit you made the whole thing up, had no proof and then strung the whole thing along pretending as if these polls you made up actually existed,

2) apologize for breaking your promise to not post virtually the only type of content you post, and,

3) actually honor your promise and never post NH or FSP-related content again.

 

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Bert replied on Mon, Feb 13 2012 11:39 PM

Not exactly made the whole thing up. There was talk all over NH that Dr. Paul was outperforming Romney in the polls. We were told Dr. Paul could get something like 31% and Romney 29%.

So, again, you based your whole thing about a "TON" of polls through a large game of telephone in the state of NH with most likely other FSP enthusiasts.  This is on par with me going to a bar and doing a group speculation that so-and-so might win and calculate our own hyphothesis of percentages.  That's not a poll.

I had always been impressed by the fact that there are a surprising number of individuals who never use their minds if they can avoid it, and an equal number who do use their minds, but in an amazingly stupid way. - Carl Jung, Man and His Symbols
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