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Batman shooter drugged in court?

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limitgov Posted: Wed, Jul 25 2012 3:08 PM

Was the batman shooter drugged in court?  If so, how in the world did he get the drugs?

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Jargon replied on Wed, Jul 25 2012 3:22 PM

Yes. CIA.

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You seriously think the CIA did it? What motives would they have?

I would guess that the cops have been interviewing him/ not allowing him to sleep or he simply can't sleep.  Also court is incredibly boring it's hard to stay awake there!  

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Jargon replied on Wed, Jul 25 2012 3:34 PM

I was teasing him.

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Haha. I googled it and found an article comparing it to sirhan sirhan being drugged presumably by the CIA 

 

He has been on suicide watch and docs have a 'right' to forcibly cure inmates.  So possibly they are giving him antipsychotic meds?  Though I'd think it would be highly unlikely that they would risk any chance for a mistrial by drugging him.  

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gamma_rat replied on Wed, Jul 25 2012 4:13 PM

What motives would they have?

They can ramp up the national security apparatus directly in response, and it galvanizes support for the President's anti-gun angle in an election year, which is itself a policy that is deemed to be in the interests of national security.

Remember, the interests of national security mean the interests of the guys you have charged with national security.  Their interests are a bigger budget and more power.

You Americans are truly blinded to the Beast's nature by your proximity to it if you can't see that the CIA certainly would do something like this.  I don't know that they did here, but it's where I'd put my money.

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obsession with national security quickly leads to dictatorship

“Since people are concerned that ‘X’ will not be provided, ‘X’ will naturally be provided by those who are concerned by its absence."
"The sweetest of minds can harbor the harshest of men.”

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Gamma- but what would drugging him do forthe CIA ? Not saying they don't have the power to do it, but he is going to be found guilty. If the prosecution goes for the death penalty they will get it. I don't see any benefits of drugging him
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gamma_rat replied on Wed, Jul 25 2012 4:41 PM

He's a patsy.  He probably didn't even pull a trigger or throw a CS grenade - you think the scene in that theatre as described sounds like an incident that lends itself to easy interpretation of what actually happened?  The shooter, if there was only one, was in a mask - described in many places as a SWAT/paramilitary outfit.  People thought it was part of the show.

The authorities - whether that ends up being the FBI I don't know, but I would guess - will pressure witnesses to come up with the same story - the story they want, which is that this guy was a lone nut who did it all.  Anyone who contradicts becomes a nutty outliar, and if they have any real or documentary evidence - of which there probably isn't any in this situation anyway - they suddenly become fatal accident-prone.  Whether Holmes gets death or locked up in a loony bin forever, I'm sure they don't really care - he is a throwaway.  The whole point of drugging a zombie puppet to be the throwaway is that no one is gonna volunteer for such a critical role; it's far more important to have your Manchurian Candidate patsy than a shooter - the shooter(s) can just be good old-fashioned professional hit-men.

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Malachi replied on Wed, Jul 25 2012 5:48 PM
It could be drugs but its far more likely to be a side effect of the MKultra programming, or the drugs are used to keep him from being too active and doing something that might result in another personality to the fore.
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Who knows whats up with that guy

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jmorris84 replied on Wed, Jul 25 2012 10:08 PM

I think Mike Zentz is right on the money. We don't have a clue.

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Anenome replied on Wed, Jul 25 2012 11:46 PM

Wow, this thread makes the Mises forum look like it's full of loonies >_>

It's pretty standard practice apparently to give a sedative to some defendants whom are violent, according to one news report on his first day in court.

And really, conspiracy theories already? Occam's razor, bro.

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Wheylous replied on Thu, Jul 26 2012 12:28 AM

Only one guy here suggested a conspiracy...

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limitgov replied on Thu, Jul 26 2012 8:36 AM

Why have the police refused to release the video? 

Why is evidence always kept from the public when there's contreversy?  It seems like that would be the time when you release the evidence to stop the speculation.

Also, police radio talks about multiple suspects:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=eZaBmSq89S4#!

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Malachi replied on Thu, Jul 26 2012 8:37 AM
Because the idea of people making and carrying out secret agreements is sooooooo farfetched, all anyone has to do is appeal to parsimony. Gtfoh
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gamma_rat replied on Thu, Jul 26 2012 11:21 AM

Wow, this thread makes the Mises forum look like it's full of loonies >_>

 
And you make it look like there are at least a few naive, ignorant, poorly-read, government-trusting prolls.  Well done.
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Anenome replied on Thu, Jul 26 2012 4:06 PM

Bull. There's a big difference between what's possible and what's probable. Loonies allow personal bias to influence their perception of probability.

There's no 2nd gunman on the grassy knoll. Al Queda really did crash planes into buildings on 911. And Holmes here shot up a theater, simple as that. Until you have corroborating evidence for other scenarios, inductive reasoning and occam's razor have to rule.

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I don't know, but when I first a picture of him I was able to imagine him snorting coke.

Based upon what I've heard, someone could make the case that the FBI did this, but I can't conclude that the govt wanted it to happen like I could conclude that Dick Cheney and Bush wanted the attacks of 9/11 to occur.

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Wheylous replied on Thu, Jul 26 2012 5:33 PM

I don't know, but when I first a picture of him I was able to imagine him snorting coke.

Conclusive evidence, my dear fellows! I say!

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Malachi replied on Thu, Jul 26 2012 5:34 PM
Loonies allow personal bias to influence their perception of probability.
so "loonies" is synonymous with "human being"? Or you believe in the existence of a non-loonie set of human beings? If so, could you identify one or more for us, so we can ask them how to calculate probabilities without referring to their personal experience?
Until you have corroborating evidence for other scenarios, inductive reasoning and occam's razor have to rule.
so youre suggesting that once someone has evidence, then we dont need inductive reasoning and parsimony? If you'll pardon the expression, thats bull.

the funny thing about evidence is that is means absolutely nothing without interpretation. Interpreting evidence is a cognitive task, meaning it is subjective. So its literally impossible to do as you imply should be done, and determine the probability of an outcome without subjective factors (aka bias) creeping in. And your failure to recognize this reflects negatively on your own state of bias. All humans are biased, some of us realize this and factor in a margin for error, whereas others delude themselves into thinking that the people who disagree with them are the biased ones.

you also reveal your own bias when you refer to evidence as if there isnt any, whereas there is evidence for a conspiracy in aurora, there is evidence for multiple jfk assassins, and there is evidence for government complicity in 9/11. As for the interpretation of evidence in the jfk assassination and 9/11, its beyond the scope of this thread. But dont pretend its non-existent, thats just ignorant.

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There was a gang of invisible aliens tossing rounds all over that movie theater.  One alien threw a bullet with a flex capacitor on it so hard it went back to the future smacked JFK in the back of the head.  In 20 years from now it's going to hit me too!  if youdon't believe that you're ignorant.  If you can't understand the possibility you're a biased ass and I hate you!

 

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Anenome replied on Thu, Jul 26 2012 11:37 PM

You've convinced me, Malachi. Clearly the lack of any evidence that anyone but Holmes was involved is prima fascie evidence that Dick Cheney himself shot up the entire theater and then framed poor Holmes, as part of a deal with Obama to pass a new gun law and distract from his election woes.

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Seraiah replied on Thu, Jul 26 2012 11:48 PM

I don't know much about the case, but it seems obvious that he's Schizophrenic. But maybe a more interesting story will develop. (Don't get me wrong, the whole thing is tragic.)

Also, 911 was an inside job.
I had a really fun conversation about the subject here, if anyone's interested.
Though I've pretty much given up hope on ever getting answers.

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xahrx replied on Fri, Jul 27 2012 10:07 AM

You tell me, is this man sane?

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Malachi replied on Fri, Jul 27 2012 12:27 PM
Clearly the lack of any evidence that anyone but Holmes was involved
evidence doesnt disappear simply because you try really hard to remain ignorant of it
is prima fascie evidence that Dick Cheney himself shot up the entire theater and then framed poor Holmes, as part of a deal with Obama to pass a new gun law and distract from his election woes.
I'm not surprised that your only arguments consist of denial, strawmen, and mockery. How else could you support your position that open-minded questioning of the official narrative in the presence of contradictory evidence is "loonie". Thus far, you have utterly failed to demonstrate anythng but your own deeply entrenched bias.
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Malachi replied on Fri, Jul 27 2012 12:31 PM
grant.w.underwood:

 

There was a gang of invisible aliens tossing rounds all over that movie theater.  One alien threw a bullet with a flex capacitor on it so hard it went back to the future smacked JFK in the back of the head.  In 20 years from now it's going to hit me too!  if youdon't believe that you're ignorant.  If you can't understand the possibility you're a biased ass and I hate you!

 

Is there a point to your stream-of-conciousness rant?
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cab21 replied on Fri, Jul 27 2012 12:55 PM

hopefully the evidence wins out

it's more likley gun and ammo sellers will profit than any laws being passed that involve gun control

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why isnt it obvious?  I know I'm going to be alive for the future, and that makes me happy! I also know that I will be dead in the future, and that makes me sad. sad

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Malachi replied on Fri, Jul 27 2012 6:42 PM
Do you think its rational to react with sadness to the fact of your own mortality?
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i think it is very rational to be sad at finding out when you are going to die.

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Malachi replied on Fri, Jul 27 2012 7:44 PM
Why is that?
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Torsten replied on Sat, Jul 28 2012 12:07 PM

obsession with national security quickly leads to dictatorship...

And neglecting it, perhaps as well. 

I wonder aboutthe following coincidence:
WASHINGTON — Negotiators at the United Nations are working to put final touches on a treaty cracking down on the global, $60 billion business of illicit trading in small arms, a move aimed at curbing violence in some of the most troubled corners of the world. In the United States, gun activists denounce it as an attack on their constitutional right to bear arms.

“Without apology, the NRA wants no part of any treaty that infringes on the precious right of lawful Americans to keep and bear arms,” National Rifle Association Executive Vice President Wayne LaPierre told the U.N. this month. “Any treaty that includes civilian firearms ownership in its scope will be met with the NRA’s greatest force of opposition.”

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/federal_government/fact-check-claims-that-treaty-would-curb-us-gun-rights-are-overblown/2012/07/27/gJQAo3W8CX_story.html

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Autolykos replied on Tue, Jul 31 2012 1:13 PM

Anemone:
There's no 2nd gunman on the grassy knoll.

I suggest Googling "magic bullet".

Anemone:
Al Queda really did crash planes into buildings on 911.

I suggest Googling "WTC 7".

Anemone:
Until you have corroborating evidence for other scenarios, inductive reasoning and occam's razor have to rule.

The question is, what counts as evidence and what doesn't?

The keyboard is mightier than the gun.

Non parit potestas ipsius auctoritatem.

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Maynard replied on Sat, Aug 18 2012 2:25 PM

I don’t have a definitive position on this case, given the lack of information.  However, I do have some questions about the situation:

1)  Where did James Holmes learn how to make intricate bombs?  Many “professional” bomb-makers in the middle east are missing ligaments because of the dangers of their job.  Did Holmes start with this elaborate setup of destruction, or did he work his way up with smaller bombs?

2)  After going through all the trouble of booby-trapping his apartment, why did he tell the police about it?  This man supposedly just killed 12 people with the intent of killing more.  Did he suddenly feel the need to spare some officers’ lives?

3)  Why was there a second gas mask found?  It was found hundreds of feet from Holmes’ car and the theater exit.  Why?

4)  All the witnesses from the theater say they saw a man take a call and then proceed to open the door.  Most probably thought the guy was sneaking somebody in for free.  But this witness claims the guy taking the call had a goatee (Holmes was goatee-free).  If we are to believe the official story, that that call-taking man was Holmes, where are his phone records?  Who called him and why?

5)  Where’s the footage?  Not one single security video has been released.  Why?

I have a feeling if these questions are answered, my suspicion of a set-up will likely be confirmed.

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limitgov replied on Sat, Aug 18 2012 4:47 PM

"5)  Where’s the footage?  Not one single security video has been released.  Why?

I have a feeling if these questions are answered, my suspicion of a set-up will likely be confirmed."

 

Well, ok...shit....obviously we have a situation....the public now has too much information...you guys weren;t supposed to know there were mltiple gunmen....we only have one patsy ready for this operation....ok....once things cool down with the media...we'll figure out who we can setup as the second patsy...then we'll parade him out to the media and this whole situation will hopefully fade away.

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