Free Capitalist Network - Community Archive
Mises Community Archive
An online community for fans of Austrian economics and libertarianism, featuring forums, user blogs, and more.

*** October 2012 low content thread ***

rated by 0 users
This post has 310 Replies | 16 Followers

Top 10 Contributor
Male
Posts 6,885
Points 121,845
Clayton replied on Sun, Oct 14 2012 10:16 PM

Snippets of the Presidential debate with corrected audio track:

Clayton -

http://voluntaryistreader.wordpress.com
  • | Post Points: 50
Top 100 Contributor
Male
Posts 806
Points 12,855
ThatOldGuy replied on Mon, Oct 15 2012 12:57 AM

I hear they're doing a parody of this Tuesday night.

If I had a cake and ate it, it can be concluded that I do not have it anymore. HHH

  • | Post Points: 5
Top 10 Contributor
Male
Posts 5,118
Points 87,310
ForumsAdministrator
Moderator
SystemAdministrator

This was pretty good:

To paraphrase Marc Faber: We're all doomed, but that doesn't mean that we can't make money in the process.
Rabbi Lapin: "Let's make bricks!"
Stephan Kinsella: "Say you and I both want to make a German chocolate cake."

  • | Post Points: 5
Top 10 Contributor
Male
Posts 4,987
Points 89,745
Wheylous replied on Mon, Oct 15 2012 9:15 AM

  • | Post Points: 35
Top 10 Contributor
Male
Posts 6,885
Points 121,845
Clayton replied on Mon, Oct 15 2012 11:42 AM

I just ordered this anthology of the Uncle Scrooge series for reading to my kids. I used to watch the DuckTales cartoon when I was a kid (in the 80's) but I don't think that cartoon is nearly as valuable in terms of the lessons about money, life, hard work, and so on that Carl Barks put into the original Uncle Scrooge books.

Turns out that Disney actually featured Ludwig von Mises as an important character in the "Duck Universe"!

This got me thinking... LvMI should create Amazon booklists, and a booklist of kids' books (including the above book) would be a bright idea. In addition to the LvMI store, liberty-minded people could browse Amazon for other good books not directly sold through LvMI.

Clayton -

http://voluntaryistreader.wordpress.com
  • | Post Points: 5
Top 500 Contributor
Posts 366
Points 7,345
Fephisto replied on Mon, Oct 15 2012 12:49 PM

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alcubierre_drive

Huh, that's interesting, probably economically infeasible tho--

http://fr.wikinews.org/wiki/Espace_%3A_d%C3%A9couverte_d%27une_exoplan%C3%A8te_form%C3%A9e_de_diamant

.....

Planet made of diamonds.

Recent idea for a warp drive.

..........

Gentlemen, I think the market will win this space race.

Latest Projects

"Even when leftists talk about discrimination and sexism, they're damn well talking about the results of the economic system" ~Neodoxy

  • | Post Points: 20
Top 75 Contributor
Posts 1,133
Points 20,435
Jargon replied on Mon, Oct 15 2012 5:16 PM

Today I lived through my own personal hell.

I sat through a history lecture of some statist bozo making every classic statist mistake in the book with an air of unbelievable pretension and authority:

Jeffersonian Ideology the same as Wilsonian, Parties are divided as ever *yawn*, Reagan unleashed the free market, deregulated, cut taxes, and the poor got poorer, Bill Clinton balanced the budget, Paul Ryan and Mitt Romney are dangerous individualist ideologues, Bush Jr. unleashed the free market, deregulated, cut taxes too which caused the 2008 crisis, Wilson was a classical liberal and so was Teddy Roosevelt and they curbed the big business power interests, and anyone who wants to cut back the welfare state is a reactionary conservative christian ideologue, whereas democrats are centrist, moderate, and rational.

I was in physical pain for 60 minutes and I could have blown his whole bullshit shtick open with 2 links:

http://reason.com/archives/2008/12/10/bushs-regulatory-kiss-off

http://mises.org/daily/1544

Land & Liberty

The Anarch is to the Anarchist what the Monarch is to the Monarchist. -Ernst Jünger

  • | Post Points: 20
Top 50 Contributor
Male
Posts 2,493
Points 39,355
Malachi replied on Mon, Oct 15 2012 5:38 PM
That sucks bro. Thanks for the links
Keep the faith, Strannix. -Casey Ryback, Under Siege (Steven Seagal)
  • | Post Points: 5
Top 50 Contributor
Posts 1,711
Points 29,285

One of the things that makes me angry about debating socialists is that many times, as a last resort, they will throw out out Einstein was a socialist, and therefore socialism must be the right way to go.

  • | Post Points: 5
Not Ranked
Posts 21
Points 335

Wheylous:

 

Where do they get the 1.5 trillion figure from? 1.5 trillion over 40 years averages 37.5 billion/year, the vertical axis maxes out at 20 billion.

  • | Post Points: 50
Top 10 Contributor
Male
Posts 4,987
Points 89,745
Wheylous replied on Mon, Oct 15 2012 8:28 PM

Good catch. I have no idea.

  • | Post Points: 20
Top 50 Contributor
Posts 1,711
Points 29,285

So does anyone have a response to the Einstein excuse?

  • | Post Points: 35
Top 50 Contributor
Male
Posts 2,439
Points 44,650
Neodoxy replied on Mon, Oct 15 2012 8:49 PM

Einstein's argument promoting socialism had poor economics in it . Einstein was a physicist, not an economist nor a philosopher. If you play the IQ game then you're going to end up with really stupid results. For whatever it's worth the smartest man ever was a socialist who then became an ardent libertarian way before it was cool... Kind of...

At last those coming came and they never looked back With blinding stars in their eyes but all they saw was black...
  • | Post Points: 20
Top 50 Contributor
Posts 1,711
Points 29,285

I know that the whole "Einstein said it was good so it must be" argument is pretty stupid. The thing is though, people do bring it up as a last resort when they have nothing else to throw at you. Look! The smartest guy in the world thinks my ideology is better than yours! It must be true!

  • | Post Points: 35
Top 50 Contributor
Male
Posts 2,439
Points 44,650
Neodoxy replied on Mon, Oct 15 2012 8:59 PM

Well then use the same argument back at them. The smartest man ever was on your side... Kind of.

At last those coming came and they never looked back With blinding stars in their eyes but all they saw was black...
  • | Post Points: 20
Top 50 Contributor
Posts 1,711
Points 29,285

Why do you say "Kind of..."

  • | Post Points: 20
Top 150 Contributor
Posts 659
Points 13,305
Gero replied on Mon, Oct 15 2012 9:09 PM

Veep Debate Violations

2 Americans win Nobel econ prize for match-making

ACLU says Morgan Stanley over subprime loans

White House mulls how to strike over Libya attack

Austrians proud of skydiver Fearless Felix

Study: Privatized Medicare would raise premiums

FACT CHECK: Be your own fact-checker Tuesday night

Norm Singleton Is Surprised . . .

If Two Men Go Into the Woods Without a Police Officer, How Many Will Come Out Alive?

On the Occasion of the Death of Arlen Specter, Robert Reich Spills the Beans

Ayn Rand Institute Attack on Murray Rothbard

Alex Tabarrok Goes Gaga Over Nobel Prize Winners

A Morally Repugnant Policy

Quotation of the Day…

Various items: free speech v 'community', lawlessness in Libya, sprawling surveillance state

Martha Raddatz and the faux objectivity of journalists

The Brookings Institution demands servile journalism

The Right Thing: The Abe Bolden Petition

Doesn’t the Ad Industry Trust the Free Market?

Questions on Drones, Unanswered Still

The Price of a 50-Year Myth

Nobel Peace Prize Committee Ignores the Real Heroes of Peace and Freedom

Nobel Peace Prize to the EU Is a Farce

Coming Home: Justice for our veterans

U.S.-Iran: Lessons from an Earlier War

SOVIET INVASION OF AFGHANISTAN A CASE OF MISSION CREEP, ACCORDING TO NEW BOOK AND ORIGINAL SOVIET DOCUMENTS

Pentagon Estimated 18,500 Casualties in Cuba Invasion 1962, But If Nukes Launched, "Heavy Losses" Until U.S. Responded in Kind

  • | Post Points: 20
Top 100 Contributor
Male
Posts 806
Points 12,855

 

SkepticalMetal:
Look! The smartest guy in the world thinks my ideology is better than yours! It must be true!

Appeal to Authority

 

If I had a cake and ate it, it can be concluded that I do not have it anymore. HHH

  • | Post Points: 5
Top 50 Contributor
Male
Posts 2,439
Points 44,650
Neodoxy replied on Mon, Oct 15 2012 9:58 PM

SM,

Despite the fact that Sidis calls himself a libertarian and his system must, if consistently applied lead to a very libertarian system, he nontheless says this:

"It is also important to remember that the whole group of alleged rights known as property rights are not mentioned in the Declaration of Independence's Preamble at all, and constitute no part of the basic schedule of human rights. At best, they are a device by which a community may deem it advisable to reward services rendered, and cannot be extended to conflict with personal rights, which are much more fundamental. Questions such as wages, returns on investments, currency, taxation, etc., all belong to this class, and do not involve fundamental rights in any way whatever. "Property rights" bulk larger than personal rights in the activities of any government existing under the present economic system, and displace everything else in the estimation of such economic organisations as industries, unions, etc.; but, from the point of view presented here, they merely constitute interference with the issue, which is exclusively the question of personal rights."

At last those coming came and they never looked back With blinding stars in their eyes but all they saw was black...
  • | Post Points: 20
Top 500 Contributor
Posts 113
Points 1,685
RagnarD replied on Mon, Oct 15 2012 10:42 PM

I'm sure this was posted here back around when it came out, but it's so uplifting I figured I'd post it again.

  • | Post Points: 5
Top 50 Contributor
Posts 2,417
Points 41,720
Moderator
Nielsio replied on Tue, Oct 16 2012 8:53 AM

Rothbard Misunderstood And Misrepresented Mises’s Morality | by Niels van der Linden

http://nielsio.tumblr.com/post/33676535585/rothbard-misunderstood-and-misrepresented-misess

  • | Post Points: 20
Top 50 Contributor
Male
Posts 2,493
Points 39,355
Malachi replied on Tue, Oct 16 2012 12:06 PM
That fact-check article on the veep debate is even more misleading than the actual debate, haha
Keep the faith, Strannix. -Casey Ryback, Under Siege (Steven Seagal)
  • | Post Points: 5
Top 50 Contributor
Male
Posts 2,493
Points 39,355
Malachi replied on Tue, Oct 16 2012 5:03 PM
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/10/12/afghanistan_n_1951668.html
But as researchers and journalists began to notice, the influx of funds also exacerbated some of Afghanistan’s worst problems. Afghanistan’s weak economy couldn’t handle the vast sums of money — in one district in the South, Nawa, U.S. development funding amounted to $400 for every man, woman and child living there. Afghanistan’s per capita income is only $300. The result was often a spike in corruption, and other unforeseen consequences.

One of the most withering examples of these side effects was an agriculture project run by USAID. Started around the time of the surge, the plan had been to spend $150 million on an obscure agriculture and employment program in Helmand and Kandahar. But, as Chandrasekaran writes, when Holbrooke heard about it, his response was quick and unequivocal: “Double it.”

“It was a tsunami of money,” writes Chandrasekaran, who followed the funds as they were dispersed in Helmand. One day in the fall of 2010, he discovered, teachers in Nawa had stopped showing up at schools across the district. At $5 a day, it turned out, digging ditches for the agriculture project was far more lucrative.

Earlier this year, SIGAR, the internal auditor, took a closer look at some of the apparent success stories of development, including a 2011 road construction project between the towns of Lashkar Gah and Nawa. The road should have made everybody happy, by helping farmers in Nawa reach the markets of Lashkar Gah. (“Roads pave the way to stability,” USAID declared in a brochure for another road-building project this year.)

But when SIGAR examined it, the project was over budget and behind schedule, particularly since the Afghan government had failed to negotiate land rights with property owners whose land would be destroyed.

“The local population expressed ongoing frustration with the project,” the SIGAR report stated. Projects like this, the report went on, “may result in adverse COIN effects because they create an expectations gap among the affected population or lack citizen support.”

In a formal response to the report, David Sedney, the deputy assistant secretary of defense for Afghanistan and Pakistan, wrote that false hopes were better than none at all. “Clearly, if dashed hopes can produce adverse effects, then that very hope produces positive COIN effects in advance of project implementation,” Sedney said.

in case any of you were wondering what kind of answer you get when you ask a bureaucrat why his policies are so stupid, check out the bolded part.
Keep the faith, Strannix. -Casey Ryback, Under Siege (Steven Seagal)
  • | Post Points: 5
Top 50 Contributor
Male
Posts 2,493
Points 39,355
Malachi replied on Tue, Oct 16 2012 6:28 PM
In the connecticut smartass championship bout: Peter Schiff interviews Ann Coulter:

http://www.blubrry.com/schiff/1247248/ann-coulter-interview/

Keep the faith, Strannix. -Casey Ryback, Under Siege (Steven Seagal)
  • | Post Points: 20
Top 500 Contributor
Posts 232
Points 4,905

Hi, I'm wondering how early on I should read Man, Economy, and State and/or Human Action.

So far I've read stuff like Econ in One Lesson, Meltdown, How Capitalism Saved America, How an Economy Grows and Why It Crashes, etc.

Should I...

A) Read a bunch of books on austrian economics and then finish my reading with both of those books

B) read both of those books, then read a bunch of stuff on austrian econ

C) read both of those books, read a bunch of stuff on austrian econ, then read both of those books again

D) read one of those books, read a bunch of stuff on austrian econ, and then read the other

 

thanks

  • | Post Points: 35
Top 200 Contributor
Male
Posts 444
Points 6,230

fegeldolfy:
Hi, I'm wondering how early on I should read Man, Economy, and State and/or Human Action.

So far I've read stuff like Econ in One Lesson, Meltdown, How Capitalism Saved America, How an Economy Grows and Why It Crashes, etc.

Have you listened to many of the lectures?  I would most likely recommend listening to a few years of Mises University before reading those books.  This would give you a great base to more easily understand/absorb the ideas in Man, Economy, and State, and Human Action:

https://www.mises.org/media/categories/145/Mises-University-2009

https://www.mises.org/media/categories/236/Mises-University-2010

https://www.mises.org/media/categories/256/Mises-University-2011

My long term project to get every PDF into EPUB: Mises Books

EPUB requests/News: (Semi-)Official Mises.org EPUB Release Topic

  • | Post Points: 20
Top 50 Contributor
Posts 1,711
Points 29,285

  • | Post Points: 20
Top 50 Contributor
Posts 2,417
Points 41,720
Moderator
Nielsio replied on Tue, Oct 16 2012 8:52 PM

Hi fegeldolfy,

I recommend Menger's Principles of Economics before those two.

http://www.vforvoluntary.com/books/economics/

  • | Post Points: 5
Top 10 Contributor
Male
Posts 4,987
Points 89,745
Wheylous replied on Tue, Oct 16 2012 9:07 PM

I think that some basic Austrian theory and a class in standard micro and macro are good enough to support you through MES.

  • | Post Points: 5
Top 150 Contributor
Posts 659
Points 13,305
Gero replied on Tue, Oct 16 2012 9:08 PM

Syrian rebels in Aleppo mostly poor, pious, rural

Clinton takes Benghazi responsibility; GOP unmoved

The Evil Conservative Base

Just Another Crony Capitalist

Vote for Liberty by Not Voting

I almost fully agree with Daniel J. Sanchez, but I disagree about the voting issue. Tom Woods said, ‘I realize I'm in the minority here, but I'm unconvinced that not voting is the obvious libertarian position . . . (1) You are not consenting to the system by voting.  I can't remember who it was who made this analogy (which I have modified slightly), but if you were in a concentration camp and you were allowed to vote on having either steak or human flesh for dinner, you would not be consenting to the system by voting for steak.’

I see the election like this: Obama and Romney are more alike than different. I oppose the U.S. war on drugs. They don’t. I don’t support widespread surveillance of U.S. citizens. They aren’t discussing it because it’s not an issue. I want a free economy. They would shudder at the thought of that. So I am stuck between Evildoer 1 and Evildoer 2. The only issue that will likely directly affect me is taxes. I don’t want my taxes to rise. At least Romney gives lip service to budgetary restraint which is more than I get out of Obama. It’s a horrible choice, but the lesser of evils is, by definition, evil.

The lame rules for presidential debates: a perfect microcosm of US democracy

Heaven Is Real: A Doctor’s Experience With the Afterlife

The Nobel Prize Fantasy: The European Union as a Peacekeeper

Live Blog of the Second Presidential Debate

John Goodman: The Better Solution for 'Pre-Existing Conditions'

  • | Post Points: 35
Top 500 Contributor
Posts 232
Points 4,905

@ Nielso

@ Wheylous

 

Thanks for the suggestions. I guess I'll familarize myself better with Austrian stuff before I try to tackle Man Economy and State.

  • | Post Points: 20
Top 10 Contributor
Male
Posts 4,987
Points 89,745
Wheylous replied on Tue, Oct 16 2012 9:41 PM

I mean, technically, you could read MES without any background. It's meant to be logical and step-by-step.

  • | Post Points: 20
Top 10 Contributor
Male
Posts 4,987
Points 89,745
Wheylous replied on Tue, Oct 16 2012 10:21 PM

I'm debating two Republicans and they are Oh so Blind!!!

  • | Post Points: 20
Top 500 Contributor
Posts 232
Points 4,905
fegeldolfy replied on Tue, Oct 16 2012 10:26 PM

What would you recommend if I've already read Econ in One Lesson, Meltdown, How Capitalism Saved America, How an Economy Grows and Why It Crashes, and End the Fed?

  • | Post Points: 20
Top 200 Contributor
Male
Posts 432
Points 6,830
Groucho replied on Tue, Oct 16 2012 10:41 PM

HamsterHuey:

Where do they get the 1.5 trillion figure from? 1.5 trillion over 40 years averages 37.5 billion/year, the vertical axis maxes out at 20 billion.

 
The might be using the 2010 Future Value of all the dollars spent, or using different sources for the yearly spending and cummulative spending. But it definitely doesn't add up as shown.
An idealist is one who, on noticing that roses smell better than a cabbage, concludes that it will also make better soup. -H.L. Mencken
  • | Post Points: 5
Top 75 Contributor
Posts 1,133
Points 20,435
Jargon replied on Tue, Oct 16 2012 10:44 PM

Just jump in already Fegel! Start tonight!

I haven't read MES so I can't comment, though I believe that HA has a longer introductory section which pertains more to sociology and methodology before it jumps into the meat and potatoes. 

Remember, if you're skimming through the book and not understanding it, then what's the point of reading it? Some things you just plain won't get the first time, so mark the page you're confused about and move on if it's still not coming through.

Land & Liberty

The Anarch is to the Anarchist what the Monarch is to the Monarchist. -Ernst Jünger

  • | Post Points: 5
Top 50 Contributor
Male
Posts 2,439
Points 44,650
Neodoxy replied on Tue, Oct 16 2012 10:46 PM

"I mean, technically, you could read MES without any background. It's meant to be logical and step-by-step."

I think that this is really true up until chapter 5. As soon as Rothbard started talking about the stages of production. At that point it seems to me extremely academic, and it always seemed like Rothbard skipped or quickly browsed over essential parts of the analysis.

At last those coming came and they never looked back With blinding stars in their eyes but all they saw was black...
  • | Post Points: 35
Top 500 Contributor
Posts 232
Points 4,905
fegeldolfy replied on Tue, Oct 16 2012 10:57 PM

I guess I'll start it w/ Murphy's study guide once I finish Mises' Anti Capitalistic Mentality. If it gets too tough, I'll take a break.

  • | Post Points: 35
Top 50 Contributor
Male
Posts 2,439
Points 44,650
Neodoxy replied on Tue, Oct 16 2012 11:02 PM

You mean the study guide to MES?

At last those coming came and they never looked back With blinding stars in their eyes but all they saw was black...
  • | Post Points: 20
Page 4 of 8 (311 items) « First ... < Previous 2 3 4 5 6 Next > ... Last » | RSS