Free Capitalist Network - Community Archive
Mises Community Archive
An online community for fans of Austrian economics and libertarianism, featuring forums, user blogs, and more.

Rand Paul growing worse and worse

rated by 0 users
This post has 38 Replies | 9 Followers

Top 10 Contributor
Male
Posts 4,987
Points 89,745
Wheylous Posted: Wed, Dec 5 2012 3:11 PM

Rand Paul votes yes on tougher sanctions of Iran:

http://www.dailypaul.com/264797/senate-votes-to-tighten-sanctions-on-iran-rand-paul-votes-yes-11-30-12

Voted yes on massive military defense budget:

http://www.economicpolicyjournal.com/2012/12/rand-paul-votes-in-favor-of-631-billion.html

Voted yes on Feinstein amondment to NDAA which (allegedly by some rights groups) doesn't fix the NDAA and in fact might make it worse:

http://www.businessinsider.com/ndaa-americans-indefinite-detention2012-11?0=defense

http://www.aclu.org/national-security/human-rights-religious-civil-liberties-and-immigration-rights-groups-oppose

 

Rand Paul, I am disappoint.

  • | Post Points: 65
Top 50 Contributor
Posts 1,711
Points 29,285

Sure would be interesting to know why the guy flew off the handle in the first place.

  • | Post Points: 35
Top 100 Contributor
Posts 814
Points 16,290

Rand Paul is a Republican Party loyalist and a nationalist, quite unlike his confederalist and independent minded father.

Did anyone else besides me read that he has plans to take a trip to Israel too?

He's in the pockets of AIPAC I think.

Anyway, his father is the Natural One %, he has the same Meyer's psychological type as Jesus and Jefferson did so it's unlikely his son would have the same type.  His father truly was a gift from Nature's God... too bad too many people rejected Nature's Gift.

Even if we had a monarch who was the natural 1%, he would still get compromised because he would care for too many people for there to be a world of peace and anarcho-confederalism.

  • | Post Points: 5
Top 50 Contributor
Male
Posts 2,439
Points 44,650
Neodoxy replied on Wed, Dec 5 2012 4:01 PM

How the hell can his dad let him pull this shit? If my son were acting out like some sort of Neo-con punk then I'd take a page out of the Simpson's book of parenting.

Edit

SM,

I do love what "going of the handle" constitutes around here :)

At last those coming came and they never looked back With blinding stars in their eyes but all they saw was black...
  • | Post Points: 35
Top 500 Contributor
Posts 151
Points 2,705

It is interesting to wonder how it is "at home" between father and son. Maybe when Rand entered politics the two came to some kind of understanding that he would be independent and the two wouldn't fight each other over their positions?

  • | Post Points: 5
Top 50 Contributor
Posts 1,711
Points 29,285

@ Neodoxy

i dun get it

And I used to like The Simpsons until I found out it was progressive...and the show started to suck as it's animation grew better.

  • | Post Points: 35
Top 50 Contributor
Male
Posts 2,439
Points 44,650
Neodoxy replied on Wed, Dec 5 2012 5:39 PM

SM,

My point was that "off the handle" on this website is the same as mainstream Republicanism everywhere else.

At last those coming came and they never looked back With blinding stars in their eyes but all they saw was black...
  • | Post Points: 20
Top 50 Contributor
Posts 1,711
Points 29,285

Oh. Yes.

Also, this will derail the thread, but why is it that so many libertarians like the movie "Fight Club?" After I saw it, my conclusion that it was anti-capitalist even by our definition of it.

  • | Post Points: 50
Top 75 Contributor
Posts 1,288
Points 22,350

And I used to like The Simpsons until I found out it was progressive...and the show started to suck as it's animation grew better.

Classic Simpsons isn't partisan and there's heaps of libertarian themes in there.  The writer of the most Simpsons episodes, John Swartzwelder, is a libertarian.  Avoid episodes after season 12, though.  There are very few good ones in there, and it becomes more and more left wing.

The Voluntaryist Reader: http://voluntaryistreader.wordpress.com/ Libertarian forums that actually work: http://voluntaryism.freeforums.org/index.php
  • | Post Points: 35
Top 50 Contributor
Posts 1,711
Points 29,285

A real example of left-wing shit is Family Guy. The show was nice before it got cancelled, but afterwords, Seth Macfarlane just used it as an outspeaker for his liberal views.

  • | Post Points: 20
Top 75 Contributor
Posts 1,612
Points 29,515

lassic Simpsons isn't partisan and there's heaps of libertarian themes in there.

An old halloween episode around Clinton and Dole:

Alien as Bob Dole: "It's a two party system.  You have to vote for one of us!"

Aliens laugh

Audience Member:  "I think I'll vote for a third party!"

Alien as Bill Clinton: "Go ahead, throw you vote away!"

Aliens laugh.

I still like the simpsons.  Seasons 17 and 18 started to get better and they arestill alright to very good.  Lisa is only wrong half the time (she's always been anti-gun).  But Groening loves Al Gore (Futurama) and hates Nixon (Futurama).

 

"The Fed does not make predictions. It makes forecasts..." - Mustang19
  • | Post Points: 20
Top 50 Contributor
Posts 1,711
Points 29,285

I really love watching Futurama, but everytime Al Gore's head appears it makes me cringe.

  • | Post Points: 20
Top 200 Contributor
Posts 452
Points 7,620

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y8ArvYLz32E

http://thephoenixsaga.com/
  • | Post Points: 5
Not Ranked
Posts 100
Points 2,375

 

Fight Club is in a way anti-capitalist, but it's much more than that. The ideas of Tyler Durden's philosophy aren't promoted by the author as being correct and nor are the ideas of Jack (or the narrator)... the author feels that people should seek a balance between extremes. 

People want to bash movies and art of any kind on these forums just for being anti-libertarian, but I don't think that does the art justice at all. Fight Club isn't just some anti-capitalist message, it's a guide for boys becoming men in a consumerist world. In fact it's not so much anti-capitalist as it is anti-consumerism. And by anti-consumerism, I don't mean to say that it promotes owning nothing at all, but more that it promotes not going out and "working at a job you hate just to buy shit you don't need."

Fight Club has some good messages. You take some, you leave some.

  • | Post Points: 35
Not Ranked
Posts 100
Points 2,375

Quotes aren't working for me, but that was meant to be directed at SkepticalMetal

  • | Post Points: 5
Top 50 Contributor
Posts 1,711
Points 29,285

I see. You know, ever since joining the libertarian movement I've felt the need to restrict myself on what types of art I can and can't enjoy.

  • | Post Points: 5
Top 50 Contributor
Posts 2,679
Points 45,110

jaredsmith:

Fight Club is in a way anti-capitalist, but it's much more than that. The ideas of Tyler Durden's philosophy aren't promoted by the author as being correct and nor are the ideas of Jack (or the narrator)... the author feels that people should seek a balance between extremes. 

Yeah I think it's safe to say that not only is the message anti-consumerist, Tyler Durden's philosophy is also meant to be horrifying. I wouldn't read too much anti-capitalism into the movie.

  • | Post Points: 5
Top 50 Contributor
Male
Posts 2,939
Points 49,110
Conza88 replied on Wed, Dec 5 2012 10:18 PM

Re: "Sure would be interesting to know why the guy flew off the handle in the first place."

The key is that he was never there in the first place.

Ron Paul is for self-government when compared to the Constitution. He's an anarcho-capitalist. Proof.
  • | Post Points: 5
Top 200 Contributor
Male
Posts 432
Points 6,830
Groucho replied on Wed, Dec 5 2012 11:10 PM

SkepticalMetal:

A real example of left-wing shit is Family Guy. The show was nice before it got cancelled, but afterwords, Seth Macfarlane just used it as an outspeaker for his liberal views.

Am I the only one who thinks Seth Macfarlane looks like Peter Brady? Ever seen the two of them together? Hmm

Coincidence? I THINK NOT!

An idealist is one who, on noticing that roses smell better than a cabbage, concludes that it will also make better soup. -H.L. Mencken
  • | Post Points: 20
Top 50 Contributor
Posts 1,711
Points 29,285

@ Groucho

Wow.

But yeah, I'm very much convinced now that Hollywood has a liberal agenda. Nowadays you see frauds like Sacha Baron Cohen humiliating the face of the libertarian movement by tricking Ron Paul.

  • | Post Points: 20
Top 500 Contributor
Male
Posts 305
Points 7,165

I have to admit, that scene in Bruno was pretty funny, although it made me a little sad on the inside.

And yes, Hollywood is left-wing as hell. You don't have to be a neocon to realize that almost everything in the entertainment industry is left-wing. I think it's hilarious that people think that FoxNews is somehow "biased" while no other major networks catch nearly as much flak. I'm not a fan of FoxNews, but at least they have Stossel, who has to rank as one of the most influential libertarians alive.

Also, @SkepticalMetal, why do you feel you have to restrict what type of art you're into? I still love the Dead Kennedys and Rage Against the Machine despite their obvious philosophical misplacements. And as far as visual art, screw visual art; 99% of it is self-felating garbage.

On a completely unrelated note, I love Game of Thrones. The indiginous people who live north of the Wall are basically anarchists. They attempt to educate some of the main characters who live under a king about the virtues of true freedom, not living under a ruler; having self-determination and being free from the entanglement of the state. In response, the "civilized" people under the king try to slaughter them.

  • | Post Points: 35
Top 50 Contributor
Posts 1,711
Points 29,285

I don't know, I guess there's this voice in the back of my head that tells me that I'm...betraying...something when I watch something that's anti-libertarian. I mean ever since I got introduced to this whole thing I've looked at the world with a lot more cynicism - Boy Scouts, School, movies...everything that I used to be fine with has been tossed upside down now that I see "the truth."

  • | Post Points: 5
Not Ranked
Posts 98
Points 1,895

SkepticalMetal:
Sure would be interesting to know why the guy flew off the handle in the first place.

He never was on the handle.  People just made the mistake of assuming he was and didn't pay attention...

http://www.economicpolicyjournal.com/2012/06/rand-paul-i-am-not-libertarian.html

 

I also remember a youtube video about "advice to libertarian fathers" where a guy likens Ron Paul's failure with Rand to his own failure with his son.

 

EDIT

found it

http://mises.org/community/forums/t/30962.aspx

 

  • | Post Points: 5
Top 50 Contributor
Male
Posts 2,209
Points 35,645
Merlin replied on Thu, Dec 6 2012 7:12 AM

SkepticalMetal:

Also, this will derail the thread, but why is it that so many libertarians like the movie "Fight Club?" After I saw it, my conclusion that it was anti-capitalist even by our definition of it.

I myself like it because it’s a damn good movie, even if anarcho-primitivist. I have reason to think that, due to man’s innate mental makeup, we’ll never find a libertarian movie as enjoyable as a collectivist one. I could, of course, be wrong.

The Regression theorem is a memetic equivalent of the Theory of Evolution. To say that the former precludes the free emergence of fiat currencies makes no more sense that to hold that the latter precludes the natural emergence of multicellular organisms.
  • | Post Points: 20
Top 10 Contributor
Male
Posts 4,987
Points 89,745

The bruno scene wasn't funny at all to me. It actually made me very uncomfortable watching it. Not because of Bruno, because of Ron Paul.

  • | Post Points: 35
Top 50 Contributor
Posts 1,711
Points 29,285

Yeah. Now we have leftist jerks calling us homophobic or whatever because of Ron Paul's response to Sacha Baron Cohen when he did what he did. Oh yeah, what would Obama have done, would he have said "yes we can?" In his deceptive tactics the idiot created another excuse for RP haters.

  • | Post Points: 5
Top 100 Contributor
Posts 875
Points 14,180
xahrx replied on Thu, Dec 6 2012 10:53 AM

"Also, this will derail the thread, but why is it that so many libertarians like the movie "Fight Club?" After I saw it, my conclusion that it was anti-capitalist even by our definition of it." - SkepticalMetal

Because it was anti establishment in general, and because it was reactionary against the general pussification of the American male, both of which many libertarians would find common cause with even if they disagreed on a fundamental level with where Tyler Durden took things.  Different ideologies can come to the same conclusion via different routes, and find common cause because of the thematic content that underlies their movements.

"I was just in the bathroom getting ready to leave the house, if you must know, and a sudden wave of admiration for the cotton swab came over me." - Anonymous
  • | Post Points: 5
Top 50 Contributor
Posts 1,711
Points 29,285

@ Merlin

The original Star Wars trilogy was pretty anti-collectivist. In fact, the Mises website has a really awesome film list composed of some anti-establishment pro-libertarian movies.

  • | Post Points: 5
Top 500 Contributor
Male
Posts 317
Points 6,805

Why don't you post the postive things Rand has done, and we can weigh it out?

  • | Post Points: 35
Top 500 Contributor
Posts 151
Points 2,705

Here's his appearance today on Schiff's show.

Even though I prefer his father's more principled stances, I don't know if we can call him a 'traitor'. I mean, did he ever promise to be a clone of his father? We shouldn't be angry just because he's a different person with different values and priorities. That's completely normal and no one's going to be the PERFECT libertarian. And like has been said before, it's funny that so many of us, even libertarians, seem to fall victim to some sort of innate desire for an American royal family!

  • | Post Points: 20
Top 50 Contributor
Posts 1,711
Points 29,285

Could you please specify on what you mean by "American royal family?"

  • | Post Points: 20
Top 500 Contributor
Posts 151
Points 2,705

Well, first of all, I'm talking about the way people, especially in the media, treat the president and his family. The way they're so fascinated with everything about his personal life. The name of his dog, the food he likes to eat, the sports teams he follows, his singing skills, etc. This kind of bootlicking has no place in a republic.

Second, I think people are expecting Rand to be his father just because they're related. In the same way Democrats trust the Kennedy "brand", some libertarians were getting too caught up in a Paul brand.

  • | Post Points: 20
Top 10 Contributor
Male
Posts 4,987
Points 89,745

dude6935 - how about we do the same for Ron Paul. I'll start by listing bad things he voted for:

-

  • | Post Points: 20
Top 50 Contributor
Posts 1,711
Points 29,285

@ fountainhead

Ah yes, the cult of Obama. It really is too bad Thomas Jefferson couldn't be resurrected. I'm not the guy's number 1 fan or anything, but I would just love for him to see how the Oval Office occupier's family has been deified.

  • | Post Points: 5
Top 100 Contributor
Male
Posts 853
Points 17,830

Wheylous:

dude6935 - how about we do the same for Ron Paul. I'll start by listing bad things he voted for:

-

I wonder what votes Murray Rothbard had in mind when he wrote this in 1982...

The current issue of Lib. Vanguard (October 1982) is a cornucopia of goodies, a veritable blockbuster. There is a thoroughly researched article by Justin Raimondo, "Ron Paul for President?", which exposes the manifold anti-libertarian aspects of Congressman Ron Paul's voting record in the current Congress. The point of the article is that while Congressman Paul's voting record may be fine as a Republican, Libertarian candidates, particularly new converts aspiring to run for President, must be held to a far higher standard. And the odious Crane machine has been making loud noises about Mr. Paul for the LP Presidential nomination. While everyone has free will and can change his mind, Mr. Paul as a candidate for the LP nomination would have to face up to and repudiate his long list of anti-libertarian votes and stands before anyone except the goose-stepping devotees of the Crane Machine could even consider him for such a high post.

  • | Post Points: 5
Not Ranked
Posts 98
Points 1,895

Wheylous:
The bruno scene wasn't funny at all to me. It actually made me very uncomfortable watching it. Not because of Bruno, because of Ron Paul.

Ron Paul was in Bruno too?  I never saw that one.  How the hell did he get fooled by the same guy twice??

 

  • | Post Points: 20
Top 50 Contributor
Posts 1,711
Points 29,285

Now THIS one I like.

  • | Post Points: 20
Not Ranked
Posts 16
Points 335

Sacha was hilarious back in his old roles of Ali G or Borat, where he would troll or insult the hell out of uptight, upper class white people who always seemed to take his antics all too seriously. Just watch one of his clips where he mocks a politician by pretending to be oblivious to what political party he belongs to (all of them are avalaible on youtube). He went in decline after his Borat movie, and his late Dictator film was largely passe by any standard.

 

And yes, Hollywood is left-wing as hell. You don't have to be a neocon to realize that almost everything in the entertainment industry is left-wing.

 

Except when it releases another patriotic war schlock drenched in bodily fluids spilled over various Pentagon military hardware. It isn't left-wing as much as it is fanatically state worshipping. Honestly, I find movies and media released by Hollywood these days resembling more and more Stalinist  or Nazi propaganda. 

 

 

 

 

  • | Post Points: 20
Top 50 Contributor
Posts 2,258
Points 34,610
Anenome replied on Wed, Dec 19 2012 5:08 AM

The real question is why you expect something out of Rand in the first place. He's a politician trying to stay a poltician. Paul was a major aberration, a politician trying to end the job of all politicians.

Autarchy: rule of the self by the self; the act of self ruling.
  • | Post Points: 5
Page 1 of 1 (39 items) | RSS