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Good book for friend

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Kelvin Silva Posted: Sun, Sep 16 2012 5:26 PM

So my friend is pretty open minded and he has read meltdown, anatomy of the state.

Hes more of a conservative but not fully libertarian (ancap)  you see, but i like that hes open minded and he usually criticizes government alot.

Since i have finished reading economics in 1 lesson, and i dont think ill look at it again, i would give that book to him.

Or should i give him another type of book?

I kinda want to give it to him so that when He is finished he will do what i did to him... share with others the knowledge.

Thoughts?

“Since people are concerned that ‘X’ will not be provided, ‘X’ will naturally be provided by those who are concerned by its absence."
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Conomics in One Lesson is a fantastic book to recommend, not only because of the breadth of topics is covers as far as the ignorance of government, but because it is well-written so as to keep one's attention and keep one ready to keep reading.

Our Enemy, The State by Albert Jay Nock is another good one for something like this, I'd say.

The only one worth following is the one who leads... not the one who pulls; for it is not the direction that condemns the puller, it is the rope that he holds.

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IMO economics in 1 lesson was a little boring.

Beginning was awesome but then it droned out a little.

But overall it wasnt that bad.

Hes mainly interested in politics but for anyone to argue politics, they must also know econ.

“Since people are concerned that ‘X’ will not be provided, ‘X’ will naturally be provided by those who are concerned by its absence."
"The sweetest of minds can harbor the harshest of men.”

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Remember the list I gave you (scroll to bottom of post)?

I'd go with these:

The Revolution: A Manifesto

Beyond Democracy & Anatomy of the State

Probably in that order.

 

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Ha, I was about to mention The Revolution, as it's the book that really presented the situation to me point blank. Great book for anyone, whether beginner or advanced.

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Ha john, i have both of those.

I might reference back to beyond democracy and anatomy of the state later, thats why i want to give him econ in 1 lesson.

The revolution is meh, i wouldnt give it to him since hes already heard too many political talking pts: abortion, foreign policy, government public works, etc, etc.

I want him to have a solid foundation in economic reasoning through economics in 1 lesson.

And its a short enough book to make a great gift.

Lessons for the young economist is more like a Textbook, which i treasure very much and would like to keep it, as well as reread it and use it for reference.

“Since people are concerned that ‘X’ will not be provided, ‘X’ will naturally be provided by those who are concerned by its absence."
"The sweetest of minds can harbor the harshest of men.”

http://voluntaryistreader.wordpress.org

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I suggest Hayek, The Fatal Conceit.

The Voluntaryist Reader: http://voluntaryistreader.wordpress.com/ Libertarian forums that actually work: http://voluntaryism.freeforums.org/index.php
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oo i might get that. But im thinking of just giving him econ. in 1 lesson.

“Since people are concerned that ‘X’ will not be provided, ‘X’ will naturally be provided by those who are concerned by its absence."
"The sweetest of minds can harbor the harshest of men.”

http://voluntaryistreader.wordpress.org

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Wheylous replied on Sun, Sep 16 2012 8:08 PM

I don't recommend you keep LftYE on your shelf for too long. It's not that amazing. Once you already know the stuff, you don't need it. I skipped that book and now I'm reading MES. I do not, however, suggest MES to your friend at the moment.

Maybe try Stossel's No They Can't. I haven't read all of it, but what I've read (especially on public education) looks mm-mm good.

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Go for the throat. I recommend something by William Appleman Williams. The American government is an ever-expanding empire, it has always been one. 

'Men do not change, they unmask themselves' - Germaine de Stael

 

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Thats true wheylous. Its a pretty basic book, but i intend to share it with others. My friend is gonna go to college so i want to give him somehing short enough but also informative.

Hmm

maybe ill rethink giving econ in 1 lesson. he needs some rothbard in him, econ in 1 lesson i feel it doesnt have that UMPH that rothbard gives when you read......

Reading rothbard is like diving into a pool, and then everything else is like learning to swim. If anything, anatomy of the state is the reason why im such a libertarian (and my other other friend lol, though hes in jail).

maybe for a new liberty, though i intend to keep that one too....

Ill take a look at william appleman williams, but if anything i want to give him a book that i already have.

Hmm ultimately i think ill just give him econ. in 1 lesson, since hes going to college it, this book needs to cover a wide variety (which it does), so when hes in his classes he can maybe refute some claims about various issues(how can you argue against tarrifs and the like, when all youve read was Meltdown?).

“Since people are concerned that ‘X’ will not be provided, ‘X’ will naturally be provided by those who are concerned by its absence."
"The sweetest of minds can harbor the harshest of men.”

http://voluntaryistreader.wordpress.org

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John James replied on Sun, Sep 16 2012 11:33 PM

Kelvin Silva:
The revolution is meh, i wouldnt give it to him since hes already heard too many political talking pts: abortion, foreign policy, government public works, etc, etc.

I'm sorry, did you just call the contents of the best selling libertarian book of all time "political talking points"?  If I didn't know you better I'd actually inclined to just respond "fuck you."

Not to mention, the way you describe it listing different specific topics it sounds like you're confusing it  with Liberty Defined (which is still a great book, just not the one for this particular situation.  Which is why I didn't recommend it for your friend.)

I strongly recommend you actually pick up a copy of The Revolution, read it, and then try to tell me it's "meh."

 

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ThatOldGuy replied on Sun, Sep 16 2012 11:45 PM

he needs some rothbard in him, econ in 1 lesson i feel it doesnt have that UMPH that rothbard gives when you read......

For a New Liberty convinced me of the plausability of anarchy. 

 

If I had a cake and ate it, it can be concluded that I do not have it anymore. HHH

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Oh and make him read The Communist Manifesto as a "what we don't stand for" type of thing. I read it as a "know thy enemy" technique.

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John James replied on Mon, Sep 17 2012 12:45 AM

SkepticalMetal:
Oh and make him read The Communist Manifesto as a "what we don't stand for" type of thing. I read it as a "know thy enemy" technique.

We have a thread going about this idea.

 

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I have read the revolution. It was alright.

Fireworks didnt go off in my head as i read it.

Im sorry if that is not what the impression i was supposed to get.

Ill re read it again.

I never said it was a bad book. I guess the reason why is because i already probably was well versed in what Paul was gonna talk about anyway.

I think i was confusing it with Liberty Defined (which i also read).

Anyhow I think I will just give him Economics in 1 lesson.

“Since people are concerned that ‘X’ will not be provided, ‘X’ will naturally be provided by those who are concerned by its absence."
"The sweetest of minds can harbor the harshest of men.”

http://voluntaryistreader.wordpress.org

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John James replied on Mon, Sep 17 2012 12:56 AM

Were you a neocon when you read it?  If you were already pretty much convinced of voluntarism, and/or had already read some books sold in the Mises Store, then yeah, I could understand.  You weren't necessarily hearing or learning anything new.

But I wasn't recommending the book to you.  The title of this thread is "good book for friend".  You described him as "more of a conservative but not fully libertarian".

The Revolution has been cited by many as the book that pushed them over the edge...that made them cross that very line you're talking about...that made them start to really see the light.

Again, I also would have bet money you were talking about Liberty Defined, the way you were describing it.

 

:EDIT (in response to your addition):

I think i was confusing it with Liberty Defined (which i also read).

As I said, I'm almost sure of it.  That's why I think you should take a look at The Revolution again.  At least go hear and just look at the contents.  Perhaps that will jog your memory.

 

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Oh, i wasnt a neocon when i read The Revolution, i was pretty much just started on being an An-Cap.

Not to mention that during 8th grade in the summer, id just spend hours and hours on youtube listening to ron paul speak. So i knew what he would be talking about. It was in 9th grade when i decided to join the mises forums and become a full An-Cap (shotly after i read Meltdown, and then a few more months i read The Revolution(which was during this year's june/july)).

Hmm, i guess i might as well give him The Revolution instead. Im sorry if im being overly confusing but this is what I go through everytime i make a decision for a good gift lol. As far as for The Reovlution, did it turn people from being neocons to minarchists, or actually Fully Libertarian (Anarchist)? I dont think the Revolution talks about the elimination of the state; by him not being fully libertarian i mean him being more of a minarchist, but not seeing the true light  darkness of the state (An-Cap), which is why i was saying that he needs some rothbard in him.

But i also have a gut feeling of giving him econ. in 1 lesson.

I could give him both you know. Or i can let him borrow one and give him the other.

Edit- Now im thinking of giving him For A New LIberty, i can make that sacrifice, (i really liked the book).

Im all over the dam place, need to make fucking decision.

/Derail

-BTW- is that youtube channel link in your signature made by you>? I remember the ideas sex video about div of labor/specalization that you suggested a few months back...

“Since people are concerned that ‘X’ will not be provided, ‘X’ will naturally be provided by those who are concerned by its absence."
"The sweetest of minds can harbor the harshest of men.”

http://voluntaryistreader.wordpress.org

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I started off a socialist. Weird things have happened. 

'Men do not change, they unmask themselves' - Germaine de Stael

 

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Wow, never even saw that thread.

Also, just a warning, trying to get through The Communist Manifesto is hell when you're a libertarian. It's like Alex in A Clockwork Orange when he's listening to Beethoven after they changed him to hate it.

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Also, just a warning, trying to get through The Communist Manifesto is hell when you're a libertarian. It's like Alex in A Clockwork Orange when he's listening to Beethoven after they changed him to hate it.

Haha you need to detach yourself from your views. Not saying that it always works but put yourself in their mindset. What is that word that Mises used that was meant to transfer the views of the past with your own. I forget how to spell it. 

'Men do not change, they unmask themselves' - Germaine de Stael

 

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Not verstehen?

systematic interpretive process in which an outside observer of a culture attempts to relate to it and understand others.(Wikipedia article on Verstehen)

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Yes that! Thank you. Verstehen is what historians should practice. Relating to the surroundings of their topic. 

'Men do not change, they unmask themselves' - Germaine de Stael

 

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Yeah, I guess I should attempt to be a little bit more open-minded. In fact, not so long ago I found a good video where Penn Jillette is describing this very same thing.

 

Problem is, I have such a hard time reading and viewing statist crap that I find to be lies. Not sure if I can pull off that flexible demeanor. I literally shut the door and put on my computer headset when my parents are watching the news.

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No way, Metal.  I disagree.  I just don't see the usefulness in constantly walking around forcing myself to believe that "maybe I'm wrong about slavery", or "maybe printing money doesn't make it worth less", just for the sake remaining perpetually "open minded".  It's nonsense.

I responded to that Penn Jillette clip here, but even better, I had a pretty lengthy discussion with Neodoxy on this very subject.  You can find it here:

from John James' "greatest hits":

"Alternative Sites"

 

For a short response, you can just listen to this passage.  But I think that discussion in that thread is pretty informative.

 

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Why do I feel like I've just had a little bit of sense slapped back in to me that I lost?

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You got John James'd

I told my friend to read the revolution ( i let him borrow it), when he finishes, then ill give him econ in 1 lesson for him to carry off to college.

“Since people are concerned that ‘X’ will not be provided, ‘X’ will naturally be provided by those who are concerned by its absence."
"The sweetest of minds can harbor the harshest of men.”

http://voluntaryistreader.wordpress.org

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Wheylous replied on Mon, Sep 17 2012 6:56 PM

I like how you slipped in "JJ's greatest hits"

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Wheylous:
I like how you slipped in "JJ's greatest hits"

Yeah you might notice I've started throwing in links to the various meta threads when I link to something included there.  If it gets more exposure to the resources, I figure why not.  More people will go and see what's collected there and probably learn more than they otherwise would have without the link included.

 

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Marko replied on Mon, Sep 17 2012 11:39 PM

Not verstehen?


Wouldn't that be Nicht Verstehen?

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Ahh yes, I'm afraid I'm still ein Junge concerning the wide world of German.

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