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What causes class disparity?

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Lockesthenes posted on Wed, Sep 2 2009 9:36 PM

I'm confused if its inflation that causes the problems of class disparity or not, and its not Capitalism thats the problem..

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This would surely rest on how you define "a class"...

Austrians do it a priori

Irish Liberty Forum 

 

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tim replied on Wed, Sep 2 2009 11:49 PM

What's the problem already?

Time will tell

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xahrx replied on Thu, Sep 3 2009 6:33 AM

Lockesthenes:
I'm confused if its inflation that causes the problems of class disparity or not, and its not Capitalism thats the problem..

What do you mean by class disparity?  Austrian class analysis basically gives you two overall classes to deal with net tax payers and net tax consumers, with the latter always trying to leech as much as possible from the former, the 'cause' being government coersion.  Inflation is one tool in the arsenal of wealth redistribution.

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what causes some people to be successful and others to not be? rational resource allocation over time compounds itself.  the more you invest your resources correctly the more resources you have available for investment rather than consumption.  credit and social spending exacerbates consumption as poor people now not only consume all that they produce in the present but also part of their future production AND part of more responsible people's resources.

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xahrx replied on Thu, Sep 3 2009 7:46 AM

nazgulnarsil:
what causes some people to be successful and others to not be?

The judgements of others as to the value of their product.  That is barring any government interference of course.  In our current system lots of people get a leg up.  I for one would love to start a winery.  The paperwork is a nightmare, the zoning even worse, and the capital outlay is ridiculous.  Without all the government requirements in place which literally have you track every movement of every fluid ounce of alcohol up to and including tracking the waste, I could easily get a nice sized shed, put a few moderate sized tanks in there, and make wine for distribution to a few friendly restaurants I know.  If anyone liked it I could build a reputation that way, earn some money, expand, etc.  Can't.  With the outlay required and all the damn paperwork I need an accountant, a lawyer, and then just to surrender my first born and I can get started.

So I guess the answer is the same thing: the government.  Without the government people are eventually judged on merit and their contribution.  With the government favoring some and disfavoring others the judgement is based on a restricted sample, and those with access to wealth enough to overcome the artifical government imposed hurdles are invariably favored over those who don't despite who may or may not produce the best product in the end.

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well yeah, that is what my post alludes to.  once you accept that success comes from allocating resources correctly you instantly see that the incentive structures government creates are dumb.  "correct" resource allocation goes from providing services actual people want to providing services that the government wants.  whomever best guesses where the government will allocate its stolen resources next will be the winner.  for example, blackwater was rewarded by being in the right place when the USG declared war.

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xahrx replied on Fri, Sep 4 2009 8:02 AM

nazgulnarsil:
well yeah, that is what my post alludes to.  once you accept that success comes from allocating resources correctly you instantly see that the incentive structures government creates are dumb.  "correct" resource allocation goes from providing services actual people want to providing services that the government wants.  whomever best guesses where the government will allocate its stolen resources next will be the winner.  for example, blackwater was rewarded by being in the right place when the USG declared war.

So you were posting the question just for a reaffirmation of sorts then?

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Unless the classes we're speaking of are host/parasite, mental problems cause class disparity (to seem to be a problem, mostly stemming from envy/feelings of inadequacy.)

Freedom of markets is positively correlated with the degree of evolution in any society...

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xahrx:

nazgulnarsil:
what causes some people to be successful and others to not be?

The judgements of others as to the value of their product.  That is barring any government interference of course.  In our current system lots of people get a leg up.  I for one would love to start a winery.  The paperwork is a nightmare, the zoning even worse, and the capital outlay is ridiculous.  Without all the government requirements in place which literally have you track every movement of every fluid ounce of alcohol up to and including tracking the waste, I could easily get a nice sized shed, put a few moderate sized tanks in there, and make wine for distribution to a few friendly restaurants I know.  If anyone liked it I could build a reputation that way, earn some money, expand, etc.  Can't.  With the outlay required and all the damn paperwork I need an accountant, a lawyer, and then just to surrender my first born and I can get started.

So I guess the answer is the same thing: the government.  Without the government people are eventually judged on merit and their contribution.  With the government favoring some and disfavoring others the judgement is based on a restricted sample, and those with access to wealth enough to overcome the artifical government imposed hurdles are invariably favored over those who don't despite who may or may not produce the best product in the end.

 

The only problem I have with this statement, is that if you weren't required to measure the % of your alcohols, then you could give someone alcohol poisoning if too much concentration is added. Those regulations are in place to protect people.

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xahrx:

nazgulnarsil:
what causes some people to be successful and others to not be?

The judgements of others as to the value of their product.  That is barring any government interference of course.  In our current system lots of people get a leg up.  I for one would love to start a winery.  The paperwork is a nightmare, the zoning even worse, and the capital outlay is ridiculous.  Without all the government requirements in place which literally have you track every movement of every fluid ounce of alcohol up to and including tracking the waste, I could easily get a nice sized shed, put a few moderate sized tanks in there, and make wine for distribution to a few friendly restaurants I know.  If anyone liked it I could build a reputation that way, earn some money, expand, etc.  Can't.  With the outlay required and all the damn paperwork I need an accountant, a lawyer, and then just to surrender my first born and I can get started.

So I guess the answer is the same thing: the government.  Without the government people are eventually judged on merit and their contribution.  With the government favoring some and disfavoring others the judgement is based on a restricted sample, and those with access to wealth enough to overcome the artifical government imposed hurdles are invariably favored over those who don't despite who may or may not produce the best product in the end.


Also, to me it seems the problem is a bureaucracy, being all the paperwork. Not that there's regulations that make it difficult to enter an industry. The paperwork aren't exactly regulations. It would make more sense if the expenses, standards, and taxes were hella high. Because, that doesn't seem like it can be a key problem to something really complicated(being class disparity).

I'm going to use the popular argument that Raeganomics is the reason for disparity among socioeconomic classes. The disparity actually widened since the Raegan years. I don't think I have to explain the 'Trickle down theory' to the Mises forum. It was one hell of an epic conservative strawman though, how people were able to cling to it for 15-20 years just blows my mind.

 

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