<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8" ?>
<?xml-stylesheet type="text/xsl" href="https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/utility/FeedStylesheets/rss.xsl" media="screen"?><rss version="2.0" xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/" xmlns:slash="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/slash/" xmlns:wfw="http://wellformedweb.org/CommentAPI/"><channel><title>General</title><link>https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/forums/27.aspx</link><description>Everything else.</description><dc:language>en</dc:language><generator>CommunityServer 2008.5 SP2 (Build: 40407.4157)</generator><item><title>Re: Little Debate Help</title><link>https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/forums/thread/268131.aspx</link><pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2009 04:35:20 GMT</pubDate><guid isPermaLink="false">944abf2b-d1be-4bf2-990d-438cb0e377e9:268131</guid><dc:creator>filc</dc:creator><slash:comments>0</slash:comments><comments>https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/forums/thread/268131.aspx</comments><wfw:commentRss>https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/forums/commentrss.aspx?SectionID=27&amp;PostID=268131</wfw:commentRss><description>&lt;p&gt;holy crap. I just spell checked it on another machine and had like 50 mispellings. At any rate when my post finally shows up i&amp;#39;d still appreciate your comments. My response to him is pending moderation.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;div style="clear:both;"&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</description></item><item><title>Re: Little Debate Help</title><link>https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/forums/thread/268129.aspx</link><pubDate>Wed, 11 Nov 2009 04:26:16 GMT</pubDate><guid isPermaLink="false">944abf2b-d1be-4bf2-990d-438cb0e377e9:268129</guid><dc:creator>filc</dc:creator><slash:comments>0</slash:comments><comments>https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/forums/thread/268129.aspx</comments><wfw:commentRss>https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/forums/commentrss.aspx?SectionID=27&amp;PostID=268129</wfw:commentRss><description>&lt;p&gt;Here was my response to him. His comments are italic. They were red in my response. FYI this ended up beign a short essay but the response is intended as a casual one so it obviously needs to be edited and I&amp;#39;m to lazy to do so. I just proofed it for a few errors and sent it off to him. I guess I&amp;#39;ll see what he says. I&amp;#39;d appreciate your comments!&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Im going give you an inline
response to your email and hopefully address some common misconceptions
regarding monopoly and how they work amongst various types. It&amp;#39;s important to
remember that a healthy economy is one where consumer demand is being met. Not
an economy where planners presume to know what consumer demand is and
arbitrarily give them random goods at random volumes. Your comments are in red.&lt;i&gt;&lt;/i&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p style="padding-left:30px;"&gt;&lt;i&gt;2. Innovation will stagnate. The controlling company will be aware
that at some point they might need to compete again but they can just raise
their research budget if and when that happens. If new technologies do come
about they will have incentive to hold off on releasing such technologies as a
kind of surprise tactic in the event that someone else enters the market.&lt;/i&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;If innovation stagnates for
too long, or prices rise too high or quality degrades too much the monopolist
has created a window of opportunity for competition to once again creep in. How
does the monopolist know when or when not to allocate resources into R&amp;amp;D?
Even the monopolist has insentive to keep his products of descent quality. The
monopoly still serves consumer demand and judges feedback of consumer input.
Even the monopolist&amp;#39;s business must be dynamic to move in the market place.The
second he stops servicing the desires of the consumer will be the second an
alternative will arrise from the ashes. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Monopolies on a free market
as well are technically not monopolies at all. A &amp;#39;good&amp;#39; on the free market must
compete for the same dollar for dollar of other various goods. The sell of a
banana must compete over the sell of an apple or the sell of a spark plug.
These producers attract market actors dollars away from competitors goods onto
their own in hopes of derriving a profit. If a monopolist does not produce
quality at a descent rate people may choose not to embark in his services any
longer. At which case he will fold and if consumer demand so desires it an
alternative will arrise.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Some market monopolies have
a hard time reading consumer demand at times. In some cases they may end up
competing against themselves of previous products or other alternatives they
created. A good example of this as you know is the Vista/XP situation. Market
actors voluntarily chose to remain with XP or downgrade too XP over the new
Vista. Even the monopolist, if Microsoft could be called that, was forced to
improve their output. However this situation occurs naturally without monopoly
presence. Technological advancements are not realized in a perfectly methodical
fashion. The typical argument of against monoply is that its quality stifles,
innovation stops may halt, and price goes up to cover&amp;nbsp;immeasurable&amp;nbsp;administrative
bloat. When these things happen they are simply opening the door for
competitors to come in and under-cut them.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Not to mention a monopoly on
the private market competes with other goods/services for the same spendable
dollar. So in all cases even a monopoly has&amp;nbsp;incentive&amp;nbsp;to please their
consumer base.&amp;nbsp;Considering these factors no imperical evidence can be
provided to support the concept that a market monoply can form on a free market
and remain sustainable. Some have argued that it&amp;#39;s technically possible but the
proof has not yet been provided. All arguments and finger pointing of modern
market monopolies have been sponsorships of the state. The cable company
included.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;In &lt;span style="text-decoration:underline;"&gt;Human Action&lt;/span&gt; Mises
summarizes several scenario&amp;#39;s of the consumer in the presence of a market
monopoly. He points out the fallacious arguments of Promonopolists and
antimonopolists. Since the state is also a market monopoly imposed by violent
force they too are subject to the same economic laws as everyone else. They
would fit under the promonopolist catagory. There is however severe mechanical
differenes between Monopolies of the state and a market monopolies which at
least serves consumer demand to an extent. I&amp;#39;ll get to that later. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p style="padding-left:30px;"&gt;Both sides in this heated
controversy resort to fallacious arguments. The antimonopoly party is wrong in
attributing to every monopoly the power to impair the situation of the buyers
by restricting supply and bringing about monopoly prices. It is no less wrong
in assuming that there prevails within a market economy, not hampered and
sabotaged by government interference, a general tendency toward the formation
of monopoly. It is a grotesque distortion of the true [p. 387] state of affairs
to speak of monopoly capitalism instead of monopoly interventionism and of
private cartels instead of government-made cartels. Monopoly prices would be
limited to some minerals which can be mined in only a few places and to the
field of local limited-space monopolies if the governments were not intent upon
fostering them.[24]&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p style="padding-left:30px;"&gt;The promonopoly party is
wrong in crediting to the cartels the economics of big-scale production.
Monopolistic concentration of production on one hand, they say, as a rule
reduces average costs of production and thus increases the amount of capital
and labor available for additional production. However, no cartel is needed in
order to eliminate the plants producing at higher costs. Competition on the
free market achieves this effect in the absence of any monopoly and of any
monopoly prices. It is,on the contrary, often the purpose of
government-sponsored cartelization to preserve the existence of plants and
farms which the free market would force to discontinue operations precisely
because they are producing at too high costs of production. The free market would
have eliminated, for example, the submarginal farms and preserved only those
for which production pays under the prevailing market price. But the New Deal
preferred a different arrangement. It forced all farmers to a proportional
restriction of output. It raised by its monopolistic policy the price of
agricultural.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;[1] &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;span style="text-decoration:underline;"&gt;Human Action&lt;/span&gt; was originally published in the US in 1949 I
beleive. You can download a free copy here. &lt;a href="http://mises.org/Books/humanaction.pdf"&gt;http://mises.org/Books/humanaction.pdf&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p style="padding-left:30px;"&gt;&lt;i&gt;If this happens in say the synthesized lysine market the end result
is increased food cost. Since the food in question is limited to processed
foods it has a large affect on the poor because there is a certain level at
which people are unable to stop purchasing. This means that symptom 1 happens
to less of an extent or if it does happen people starve.&lt;/i&gt;&lt;i&gt;&lt;/i&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;This is jumping to
conclusions a little bit here. Kosher foods and natural foods predate processed
food. A market monopoly in processed food has to compete with those things
along with compete with people who may decide to harvest their own food in such
a situation, or someone else who found an alternative way to produce food for
the masses. It is non-Sequitar to believe people would starve.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Economics is about what is
seen &lt;strong&gt;AND not seen&lt;/strong&gt;. If we try to&amp;nbsp;formulate&amp;nbsp;all things today
based on our current market conditions we can come to all kinds of wild
conclusions. For example, without Intel there would be no desktop processors.
But that is not true, we don&amp;#39;t know what would happen if Intel were gone, nor
do we know what would happen if Lysine were on a monopoly. This is why we must
root ourselves in deductive reasoning, not inductive reasoning. Also side note,
in the&amp;nbsp;absence&amp;nbsp;of IP laws as you pointed out there is no way lysine
would be a monopoly. :) &amp;nbsp;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p style="padding-left:30px;"&gt;&lt;i&gt;Back to Comcast, if Comcast establishes a monopoly on high bandwidth
communication both symptoms above will happen. Less people will use the
internet and Comcast will have little incentive to truly improve their network
at the rate they are doing it today. With education and small business relying
so heavily on these technologies the potential for both areas will be
drastically reduced.&amp;nbsp;&lt;/i&gt;&lt;i&gt;&lt;/i&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;If they did so a competitor
could easily come along and capitalize on their stagnation by introducing an
alternative. Also lets not forget that most of the cable companies in the
country have been granted local legal monopolies by their municipalities. The
government has defended it&amp;#39;s stance on granting cable company&amp;#39;s legal monopolies
by calling them &amp;quot;Natural Monopolies&amp;quot; but this was done so arbitrarily
and to be sure no such natural monopoly existed before the state intervened.
Natural Monopoly&amp;#39;s are a myth. No economist worth his two cents would make such
an economic adolescent claim. Such is the talk of politician&amp;#39;s. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Additionaly the fact that
there are other very large business, Verizon, Qwest, Clearwire, continuing to
invest in expanding their network is a clear representation that they see
profit opportunity in the market. We cannot disagree with this. If it was
non-competitive they would not be doing this. Clearly they beleive there is
still a market for expanding their networks and they beleive they can gain from
it. TO disagree with this would be disagreeing with internet provider market
specialists in Verizon, Clearwire, Qwest, and even comcast or any other network
provider. Only in arrogance can we claim to know something they do not.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p style="padding-left:30px;"&gt;&lt;i&gt;In the end I think we need a balance. Turning the internet into say,
a utility, would be the extreme opposite of free market. In both cases the only
outcome I can foresee is a reduction in potential functionality. Too many
business and educational institutes are dependant on the current infrastructure
to allow a single company to have complete control. Just like we don&amp;#39;t allow
car dealers to advertise $1 cars and then not have any available when a
consumer arrives we should not allow companies like Comcast to take what is an
open and useful tool and turn it into something they control. They benefitted
form tax payer funded research into existing communications technologies and in
exchange its not unreasonable to limit their ability to control what we have
access to in our own homes.&lt;/i&gt;&lt;i&gt;&lt;/i&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;The problem, as I understand
it, is your wanting to shift a monopoly which does serve consumer demand, which
arguably may not exist, to one which does NOT serve consumer demand and exists
through compulsory means. It is a very common fallacy to assume that compulsory
monopolies can outpreform market monopolies but it is one of the most dangerous
fallacies to fall victem too. Especially if our goal is to increase economic
output, by that I mean providing more goods at cheaper costs for all. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Putting aside the ethical
shortcomings of compulsory insitutes we will look at such insititues at an
economic level to see that they are possibly the most disasterous market
entity&amp;#39;s around. The state&amp;#39;s monopoly&amp;#39;s works entirely outside of market laws
because they use&amp;nbsp;coercion&amp;nbsp;to exist and therefore do not read consumer
demand. The state cannot measure consumer demand, it has no economic
calculation or price metric. As a result you will have more of what you
described above, technological stagnation, increased cost, lower quality.
Perhaps the single biggest exposition that explains how central planning cannot
calculate was revealed in Mises&amp;#39;s &lt;span style="text-decoration:underline;"&gt;Economic Calculation in the Socialist
Commonwealth&lt;/span&gt;. [3] I have not read the book and since I already feel
confident enough in my knowledge on the calculation problem it&amp;#39;s not high in my
reading list. However since his writing thousands of essays, articles, and
books have been written by economists adhering to the fact that central
planners cannot read consumer demand and therefore have no metric on when or
where to allocate resources.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;To continue, If a private
monopoly produces poor quality, or does not innovate for too long, or raises
their rates too much a competitor will come in and&amp;nbsp;eradicate&amp;nbsp;them.
True private monopolies tend to be short lived because of this. When does the
private monopolist know when to invest in R&amp;amp;D? When does he know when to be
conservative? Because his indicators are now restricted to himself he will at
times become a sloppy market participant offering more advantage of a more
effecient competitor to arrise. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;However if the state holds a
legal monopoly in a sector it would be illegal for competitors to enter market
in the first place. A compulsory monopolist is indefinite and perpetual. Since
the state cannot read consumer demand it will perminantly establish a monopoly
condition you outlined. No innovation, No quality, high rates either through
taxation or monetization as witnessed currently. Also, in all cases state
monopolies have never increased the supply of a good or service, they have only
rationed or relocated goods and services, they have no mechanism to help them
detirmine how much quantity of X to produce and where to produce and whom to
produce it for.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;The state does not know when
or where to allocate consumer resources. It can only do so arbitrarily. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Defenders of central
planning argue that a ballet box or voting could be a way to get around this.
To understand why this is a fallacy it is beneficial to do some basic reading
on the fundamentals of Praxeology. Voting is not a proper way of portraying consumer
demand, when you vote your decisions are imposed on others along with the risks
involved, you bear little risk in this process so your decision making process
is entirely different than a market decision. Voting does not directly effect
you personally. Praxeologically speaking, voting cannot be a method for
detirming consumer demand. Demand is&amp;nbsp;derived&amp;nbsp;on an individual basis
making individual voluntary decisions about&amp;nbsp;oneself. If the voting method
DID work however it would only do so with delays as consumers would have to
wait for beuacracy to allocate resources. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Compulsory Monopolies also
add increased administrative overhead. Since governments themselves do not
produce but outsource(redirect) their production process it does not make
economic sense for consumers who need a specific good to go through the
government in the first place. It would be far more effecient for the consumer
to go directly to the producer of said good. The compulsory Monopoly acts as a
money conduit in this example getting first dibs on the consumers extorted
cash. He also establishes a perminent residence in this now legit extortion
racket. The other issue is one of corruption. Hayek, talks about this in the
Road to Surfdom and he explains why the Worst type of people get on top in
democracy. This is why you see widespread specialist interest taking control of
washington and the strong fascistic types of relationships between big business
and government. This not a partisan issue, this is not a flaw of republican&amp;#39;s
or demicrats. All parties suffer from this as democracy suffers from this by
default. [4]&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Here is a quick list of the
differences between a private monopoly and a state run.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;strong&gt;Private&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; State&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Temporary&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; perminent&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Occasional Loss of Quality
&amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp;
&amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; Perpetual distortion of quality. No
benchmark&amp;nbsp; &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Occasional rise of prices
&amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp;
&amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp;Perpetual increase of cost. Historical&amp;nbsp;Empirical&amp;nbsp;data
provesthis &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp;
&amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp;
&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Generaly serves most people
&amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp;
&amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; No way of measuring who it serves and why, or if its even needed in the
first place&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Run on Market participation
&amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp;
&amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp;Run via force, or violent imposition onto its commmunity&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Serves Consumers&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp; Cannot
measure who it serves or why. only vaguely&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Because of the lack of
economic calculation the State usually grows in size as a form of cancer. Like
a cancer cell it consumes resources not for the good of the consumer but for
it&amp;#39;s own sake.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Also if we are to be
concerned with the poor as mentioned earlier, it does not follow to have a
state run monopoly for a service people may not use. What about folk who don&amp;#39;t
have internet, generally speaking the poorest? Does it seem ethical to raise their
taxes and force them to pay for a system that they would not participate in
voluntarily? I think Hayek states it best in the Road to Surfdom.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p style="padding-left:30px;"&gt;The belief in the community
of aims and interests with fellow-men seems to presuppose a greater degree of
similarity of outlook and thought than exists between men merely as human
beings.&lt;strong&gt;&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p style="padding-left:30px;"&gt;&lt;strong&gt;-&lt;/strong&gt;FA Hayek&lt;strong&gt;&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;[4]&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;D. T. Armentano also
summarizes most of the economic issues regarding various forms of Monopoly. He
concludes his essay explaining Murray Rothbards view of Monopoly. At least to
my knowledge most mainstream Austrian Economists would adher to Rothbard&amp;#39;s
definition. Though I cannot speak for them. To Quote Armentano.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p style="padding-left:30px;"&gt;Rothbard it will be recalled had defined monopoly as &amp;quot;a
grant of special privilege from the State&amp;nbsp;
reserving a certain area of production to one particular individual or
group.&amp;quot; This definition of monopoly would appear to be immune from the
sort of criticism employed above against both the neoclassical and
Mises-Kirzner theories of monopoly. In the first place, we can be confident
that competition is &amp;quot;lessened&amp;quot; by this sort of monopoly, and that
resources are non-optimally allocated so far as consumers are concerned, since
governmental monopoly restricts by law both competitive entry and, consequently,
free consumer choice. Legal barriers to entry restrict entry by definition.
Areas of production that are truly &amp;quot;naturally&amp;quot; monopolistic would
hardly require governmental entry restrictions. Consequently, consumer choke
must be distorted, and the sub-sequent&amp;nbsp;
resource allocations must be &amp;quot;inefficient,&amp;quot; since consumers
are prevented by law from making choices that differ from those already made
for them by the political authority. Hence, we conclude that governmental
monopoly always restricts competition, always violates consumer (and producer)
sovereignty, and always &amp;quot;injures&amp;quot; consumer welfare. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p style="padding-left:30px;"&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p style="padding-left:30px;"&gt;It would be tempting to argue that these
&amp;quot;restrictions&amp;quot; and &amp;quot;injuries&amp;quot; are, perhaps, minor in the
case of &amp;quot;minor&amp;quot; legal impediments to either production or exchange.
Yet, there is no satisfactory way to cardinally measure either
&amp;quot;competition&amp;quot; or consumer &amp;quot;utility.&amp;quot; Since utility is a
completely subjective notion, and since interpersonal comparisons of utility
are not possible, there is no objective way to determine how severe even
&amp;quot;minor&amp;quot; state impediments to entry and competition actually are. It
is completely possible, for instance, that what may appear to be an extremely
inoffensive governmental regulation, i.e., setting minimum safety standards for
sellers, may in fact be harmful in the extreme with respect to certain
potential businessmen and specific classes of consumers. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p style="padding-left:30px;"&gt;&lt;strong&gt;We conclude, therefore, that any and all state restrictions are
&amp;quot;monopolistic,&amp;quot; competition reducing, and destructive of consumer
satisfaction vis-&amp;agrave;-vis alternative free-market situations.&lt;/strong&gt; We also conclude, in summary, that this
particular theory of monopoly is the only theory that meets all the standard
critical objections and remains entirely consistent with the general Austrian
Methodology.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p style="padding-left:30px;"&gt;-Armentano&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;[5] Emphasis mine&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;To conclude, if the cable
companies do become monopolistic it was not done so under the environment of
the free-exchange but under the assistence and sponsoship of the state.
Secondly, a state run monopoly will cause far more damage then a temporary market
run monopoly. We also must remember that our goals should NOT be to foster
technological improvements for their own sake, but to devise systems that which
fill consumer demand.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;An economy that produces
things that no one wants is no economy at all but a failure at allocating
resources. We do not want to support arbitrary technological growth, but
technological growth that people want. This means however that only the
individual consumer can make those decisions as a central planner can only
guess to know what consumers want.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I think Thomas DiLorenzo
spoke about most of this in his lecture. I&amp;#39;m not sure if you&amp;#39;ve had time to
listen to it but when your playing Wow I suggest it. Here&amp;#39;s the link!&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href="http://mises.org/media/3955"&gt;http://mises.org/media/3955&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;[1] See Human Action Pg 385-388 &lt;a href="http://mises.org/humanaction/chap16sec9.asp"&gt;http://mises.org/humanaction/chap16sec9.asp&lt;/a&gt; &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;[2] See Cato Institute Essay &lt;a href="http://www.cato.org/pubs/pas/pa034.html"&gt;http://www.cato.org/pubs/pas/pa034.html&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;[3] Free PDF &lt;a href="http://mises.org/econcalc.asp"&gt;http://mises.org/econcalc.asp&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;[4] &lt;span style="text-decoration:underline;"&gt;The Road to Surfdom &lt;/span&gt;F.A.
Hayek. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;[5] A Critique of Neoclassical and
Austrian Monopoly Theory D.T. Armentano &lt;a href="http://mises.org/etexts/armentanomonopoly.pdf"&gt;http://mises.org/etexts/armentanomonopoly.pdf&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;strong&gt;Additional Media&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Robert Carreira Article &lt;a href="http://www.fee.org/pdf/the-freeman/carraira0705.pdf"&gt;http://www.fee.org/pdf/the-freeman/carraira0705.pdf&lt;/a&gt;
explains how compulsory monopolies follow different economic rules.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Inductive Reasoning &lt;a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inductive_reasoning"&gt;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inductive_reasoning&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Deductive Reasoning &lt;a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deductive_reasoning"&gt;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deductive_reasoning&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;strong&gt;Video&amp;#39;s&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;DiLorenzo &lt;a href="http://www.youtube.com/user/misesmedia#p/search/1/mwH8unDcdMY"&gt;http://www.youtube.com/user/misesmedia#p/search/1/mwH8unDcdMY&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Ron Paul (Very Old :) ) &lt;a href="http://www.youtube.com/user/misesmedia#p/search/0/8C4gRRk2i-Mc"&gt;http://www.youtube.com/user/misesmedia#p/search/0/8C4gRRk2i-Mc&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Fringe Elements Explanation for Lamo&amp;#39;s
like me&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href="http://fringeelements.ning.com/video/monopoly-2"&gt;http://fringeelements.ning.com/video/monopoly-2&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href="http://fringeelements.ning.com/video/the-coercive-monopoly"&gt;http://fringeelements.ning.com/video/the-coercive-monopoly&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;div style="clear:both;"&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</description></item><item><title>Re: Little Debate Help</title><link>https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/forums/thread/267624.aspx</link><pubDate>Mon, 09 Nov 2009 20:26:39 GMT</pubDate><guid isPermaLink="false">944abf2b-d1be-4bf2-990d-438cb0e377e9:267624</guid><dc:creator>nirgrahamUK</dc:creator><slash:comments>0</slash:comments><comments>https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/forums/thread/267624.aspx</comments><wfw:commentRss>https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/forums/commentrss.aspx?SectionID=27&amp;PostID=267624</wfw:commentRss><description>&lt;p&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;div&gt;&lt;img src="https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/Themes/mises2008/images/icon-quote.gif"&gt; &lt;strong&gt;filc:&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div&gt;He argues that service providers are wasting resources by each planting their own fiber network. &lt;/div&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;They disagree with his prognosis that they are wasting resources if they do plant their own networks, they see profit opportunities in their&amp;nbsp;competitive&amp;nbsp;practices. and he is against that?&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;ask him gently to think about it again.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;div style="clear:both;"&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</description></item><item><title>Re: Little Debate Help</title><link>https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/forums/thread/267623.aspx</link><pubDate>Mon, 09 Nov 2009 20:16:18 GMT</pubDate><guid isPermaLink="false">944abf2b-d1be-4bf2-990d-438cb0e377e9:267623</guid><dc:creator>Spideynw</dc:creator><slash:comments>0</slash:comments><comments>https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/forums/thread/267623.aspx</comments><wfw:commentRss>https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/forums/commentrss.aspx?SectionID=27&amp;PostID=267623</wfw:commentRss><description>&lt;p&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;div&gt;&lt;img src="https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/Themes/mises2008/images/icon-quote.gif"&gt; &lt;strong&gt;filc:&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div&gt;He argues that service providers are wasting resources by each planting their own fiber network.&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Conjecture.&amp;nbsp; He is also arguing from the standpoint of a central planner.&amp;nbsp; He seems small-minded to me, to think he knows enough about market forces in the internet/networking market to know what is best or most efficient.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Have you told him that most cable companies are given a monopoly by the city?&lt;/p&gt;&lt;div style="clear:both;"&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</description></item><item><title>Re: Little Debate Help</title><link>https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/forums/thread/267621.aspx</link><pubDate>Mon, 09 Nov 2009 20:09:24 GMT</pubDate><guid isPermaLink="false">944abf2b-d1be-4bf2-990d-438cb0e377e9:267621</guid><dc:creator>filc</dc:creator><slash:comments>0</slash:comments><comments>https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/forums/thread/267621.aspx</comments><wfw:commentRss>https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/forums/commentrss.aspx?SectionID=27&amp;PostID=267621</wfw:commentRss><description>&lt;p&gt;The positioning hes coming from is this. At some point in time&amp;nbsp;apparently&amp;nbsp;in Seattle&amp;#39;s history tax payers paid for a city fiber network. It was to act as a utility and service providers would sign agreements with the city and connect to the public fiber backbone. This would keep comcast or anyone from having a monopoly over the internet supposedly.&amp;nbsp;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;When I heard this however I just thought of fascism again. He argues that service providers are wasting resources by each planting their own fiber network. He said it would be cheaper if there was but one fiber network. I disagree with him, I don&amp;#39;t know that it would be cheaper and knowing public&amp;nbsp;utilities&amp;nbsp;it certainly would not bring innovative improvements in the future.&amp;nbsp;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;To be honest I don&amp;#39;t think we know what the exact topology is of fiber networks in Seattle so we really have no idea of how effecient or in-effecient it is. What I do know is that Seattle citizen&amp;#39;s have paid for a city Fiber network thats gone un-used. He uses this as an argument that we should be using it, I use it as an argument of why we should have never given the state that money in the first place.&amp;nbsp;&lt;/p&gt;&lt;div style="clear:both;"&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</description></item><item><title>Re: Little Debate Help</title><link>https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/forums/thread/267614.aspx</link><pubDate>Mon, 09 Nov 2009 19:48:14 GMT</pubDate><guid isPermaLink="false">944abf2b-d1be-4bf2-990d-438cb0e377e9:267614</guid><dc:creator>nirgrahamUK</dc:creator><slash:comments>0</slash:comments><comments>https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/forums/thread/267614.aspx</comments><wfw:commentRss>https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/forums/commentrss.aspx?SectionID=27&amp;PostID=267614</wfw:commentRss><description>&lt;p&gt;I dont think he has grasped that there are literally no natural monopolies. the only evidence that would be admissable proof of a natural monopoly would be if it was legally or logically impossible for a competitior to compete, and that it was this way &amp;#39;through nature&amp;#39;. as it is certainly not logically impossible. competitors can attempt to compete, even if they are inferior and will ultimately fail, and since a legal barrier to monopoly is not on the cards for a free market (it certainly is not &amp;#39;natural&amp;#39;), one is left asking what is he afraid of?, that companies who do no evil acts, might be so good at their chosen field that a headcount of their current competition (or summing of the capital of their competition) should appear &amp;#39;low&amp;#39; from some arbitrary standard of judgement.?&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;the austrian position is that competition is not a function of &amp;#39;numbers of competitiors&amp;#39;, competition relates to the freedom to &amp;#39;try&amp;#39; and compete.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I can &amp;#39;try&amp;#39; to compete with nike, (in generic shoes if not in &amp;#39;nike&amp;#39; shoes), but can I even &amp;#39;try&amp;#39; to compete with the US post office? only indirectly so as not to appear like i am competing with them (i.e. by substitutes for the kind of mail they deliver which is non-urgent). the small silver-lining fact of the matter, is that if a government has a ridiculous monopoly, and then get somewhat lazy about monopolizing its substitutes, the free market process over time undermines the importance of the monopoly (i.e. by substituting non-monopolised alternatives, e-mail, fax, telephone, as and when they are good substitutes). allthough the costs are always felt, and a boon would follow from the abolition of the monopoly (by repeal of protectionist laws) maybe that&amp;#39;s getting off topic though....&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;to wrap up, when he writes &amp;#39;&amp;nbsp;if Comcast establishes a monopoly on...&amp;#39; he must say whether Comcast are lobbying for a legal monopoly. if they are he has points to make, we all do! that would suck. if Comcast just enjoy large market share, so that ignorant people call them &amp;#39;monopolists&amp;#39; then that does not equal them being a monopoly.&lt;/p&gt;&lt;div style="clear:both;"&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</description></item><item><title>Re: Little Debate Help</title><link>https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/forums/thread/267606.aspx</link><pubDate>Mon, 09 Nov 2009 19:05:47 GMT</pubDate><guid isPermaLink="false">944abf2b-d1be-4bf2-990d-438cb0e377e9:267606</guid><dc:creator>filc</dc:creator><slash:comments>0</slash:comments><comments>https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/forums/thread/267606.aspx</comments><wfw:commentRss>https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/forums/commentrss.aspx?SectionID=27&amp;PostID=267606</wfw:commentRss><description>&lt;p&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;div&gt;&lt;img src="https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/Themes/mises2008/images/icon-quote.gif"&gt; &lt;strong&gt;filc friend:&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div&gt;1.&lt;span&gt;	&lt;/span&gt;Some people will be unable to pay for a service who would have if there were competition. The monopoly will be OK with this as long as it is a small percent of people.&amp;nbsp;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;i&gt;Not sure how to respond to this&lt;/i&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;div&gt;&lt;img src="https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/Themes/mises2008/images/icon-quote.gif"&gt; &lt;strong&gt;filc friend:&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div&gt;2.&lt;span&gt;	&lt;/span&gt;Innovation will stagnate. The controlling company will be aware that at some point they might need to compete again but they can just raise their research budget if and when that happens. If new technologies do come about they will have incentive to hold off on releasing such technologies as a kind of surprise tactic in the event that someone else enters the market.&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;But that leaves the door open for competitors again. Not too mention a monopoly on the private market competes with other goods/services for the same spendable dollar. So in all cases even a monopoly has&amp;nbsp;incentive&amp;nbsp;to please their consumer base.&amp;nbsp;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;A true monopoly has a hard time reading the market. As a result their quality stifles, innovation stops as you suggested, and price goes up to cover&amp;nbsp;immeasurable&amp;nbsp;administrative bloat. When these things happen they are simply opening the door for competitors to come in and under-cut them. In truth though a private monopoly is not really a monopoly at all as people are not forced into purchasing their goods, and due to the way markets work a monopoly in the private sector in the absence of the state cannot last long.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;div&gt;&lt;img src="https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/Themes/mises2008/images/icon-quote.gif"&gt; &lt;strong&gt;filc friend:&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;div&gt;If this happens in say the synthesized lysine market the end result is increased food cost. Since the food in question is limited to processed foods it has a large affect on the poor because there is a certain level at which people are unable to stop purchasing. This means that symptom 1 happens to less of an extent or if it does happen people starve.&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;p&gt;
&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;This is Jumping to conclusions a little bit here. Kosher foods and natural foods predate processed food. A market monopoly in processed food has to compete with those things along with compete with people who may decide to harvest their own food. It is non-Sequitar to beleive people would starve.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Economics is about what is seen AND not seen. If we try to&amp;nbsp;formulate&amp;nbsp;all things today based on our current market conditions we can come to all kinds of wild conclusions. For example, without Intel there would be no nano-fabrication process. But that is not true, we don&amp;#39;t know what would happen if Intel were gone, nor do we know what would happen if Lysine were on a monopoly. Also side note, in the&amp;nbsp;absence&amp;nbsp;of IP laws as you pointed out there is no way lysine would be a monopoly :) &amp;nbsp;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;div&gt;&lt;img src="https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/Themes/mises2008/images/icon-quote.gif"&gt; &lt;strong&gt;filc friend:&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div&gt;Back to Comcast, if Comcast establishes a monopoly on high bandwidth communication both symptoms above will happen. Less people will use the internet and Comcast will have little incentive to truly improve their network at the rate they are doing it today. With education and small business relying so heavily on these technologies the potential for both areas will be drastically reduced.&amp;nbsp;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;If they did so a competitor could easily come along and capitalize on their stagnation by introducing an alternative.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;blockquote&gt;&lt;div&gt;&lt;img src="https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/Themes/mises2008/images/icon-quote.gif"&gt; &lt;strong&gt;filcs friend:&lt;/strong&gt;&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div&gt;In the end I think we need a balance. Turning the internet into say, a utility, would be the extreme opposite of free market. In both cases the only outcome I can foresee is a reduction in potential functionality. Too many business and educational institutes are dependant on the current infrastructure to allow a single company to have complete control. Just like we don&amp;rsquo;t allow car dealers to advertise $1 cars and then not have any available when a consumer arrives we should not allow companies like Comcast to take what is an open and useful tool and turn it into something they control. They benefitted form tax payer funded research into existing communications technologies and in exchange its not unreasonable to limit their ability to control what we have access to in our own homes.&lt;/div&gt;&lt;/blockquote&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Here is the difference. You want to shift the monopoly from a private one which does serve consumer demand to an extend and probably will be short lived to a government&amp;nbsp;coerced&amp;nbsp;monopoly. The state&amp;#39;s monopoly&amp;#39;s work outside of market laws because they use&amp;nbsp;coercion&amp;nbsp;to exist. The state cannot measure consumer demand, it has no economic calculation. As a result you will have more of what you described above.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;If a private monopoly produces poor quality, or does not innovate for too long, or raises their rates too much a competitor will come in and&amp;nbsp;eradicate&amp;nbsp;them. True private monopoly&amp;#39;s tend to be short lived because of this.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;However if the state holds a legal monopoly in a sector it would be illegal for competitors to enter market in the first place. Since the state cannot read consumer demand it will perminantly establish a monopoly condition you outlined above. No innovation, No quality, high rates(via taxation). Also, in all cases government monopoly&amp;#39;s have never increased the supply of a good or service, they have only rationed it.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt; The State&amp;#39;s monopoly is perpetual. The state does not know when or where to allocate consumer resources. It can only do so arbitrarily. Side note: Voting is not consumer demand, because when you vote your decision process is not about what effects you personally, but what effects everyone else around you. Consumer demand is&amp;nbsp;derived&amp;nbsp;on an individual basis making individual decisions about&amp;nbsp;oneself.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Here is a quick list of the differences between a private monopoly and a state run.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;b&gt;Private &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; State&lt;/b&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Temporary &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; Perminant&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Occasional Loss of Quality &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp;Perpetual distortion of quality. No benchmark for deciding what good quality is&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Occasional rise of prices &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; Perpetual increase of cost. Historical&amp;nbsp;Empirical&amp;nbsp;data proves this &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Generaly serves most people &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; No way of measuring who it serves and why, or if its even needed in the first place&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Run on Market participation &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; &amp;nbsp; Run via force, or imposition of taxes from its community&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Also if we are to be concerned with the poor as mentioned earlier, it does not follow to have a state run monopoly for a service people may not use. What about folks who don&amp;#39;t have internet, generally speaking the poorest. Does it seem ethical to raise their taxes and force them to pay for a system that they would not participate in voluntarily?&lt;/p&gt;&lt;div style="clear:both;"&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</description></item><item><title>Little Debate Help</title><link>https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/forums/thread/267595.aspx</link><pubDate>Mon, 09 Nov 2009 18:33:04 GMT</pubDate><guid isPermaLink="false">944abf2b-d1be-4bf2-990d-438cb0e377e9:267595</guid><dc:creator>filc</dc:creator><slash:comments>0</slash:comments><comments>https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/forums/thread/267595.aspx</comments><wfw:commentRss>https://archive.freecapitalists.org:443/forums/commentrss.aspx?SectionID=27&amp;PostID=267595</wfw:commentRss><description>&lt;p&gt;I have a co-worker who I think has the stuff to be converted but am having to hit from various angles. I want to make sure my responses to him are as productive I can be so I am hoping anyone here can help me out.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I emailed him in response to discussion we had over his fears of the cable market becoming a monopoly.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;----------&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href="http://fringeelements.ning.com/video/the-coercive-monopoly"&gt;http://fringeelements.ning.com/video/the-coercive-monopoly&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&amp;nbsp;Another good one is a lecture given by Tom DiLorenzo. If you want the nitty/gritty well you&amp;rsquo;ll just have to find a time to read some books =(&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href="http://mises.org/media/3955"&gt;http://mises.org/media/3955&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;div&gt;---------------------&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;His Response&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;While I agree that in most cases this seems to be true I think in certain cases where a monopoly is charging just slightly above market rates the following will happen.&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;div&gt;1.&lt;span&gt;	&lt;/span&gt;Some people will be unable to pay for a service who would have if there were competition. The monopoly will be OK with this as long as it is a small percent of people.&amp;nbsp;&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;2.&lt;span&gt;	&lt;/span&gt;Innovation will stagnate. The controlling company will be aware that at some point they might need to compete again but they can just raise their research budget if and when that happens. If new technologies do come about they will have incentive to hold off on releasing such technologies as a kind of surprise tactic in the event that someone else enters the market.&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;If this happens in say the synthesized lysine market the end result is increased food cost. Since the food in question is limited to processed foods it has a large affect on the poor because there is a certain level at which people are unable to stop purchasing. This means that symptom 1 happens to less of an extent or if it does happen people starve.&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;Symptom 2 also comes in to play because a large part of our economy today depends on synthesized lysine to lower food costs. The fact that 10% of our population can feed the other 90% has allowed many of the advanced in technology we have today. Stagnation in the food R&amp;amp;D departments could lead to stagnation in the economy as a whole.&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;Back to Comcast, if Comcast establishes a monopoly on high bandwidth communication both symptoms above will happen. Less people will use the internet and Comcast will have little incentive to truly improve their network at the rate they are doing it today. With education and small business relying so heavily on these technologies the potential for both areas will be drastically reduced.&amp;nbsp;&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;In the end I think we need a balance. Turning the internet into say, a utility, would be the extreme opposite of free market. In both cases the only outcome I can foresee is a reduction in potential functionality. Too many business and educational institutes are dependant on the current infrastructure to allow a single company to have complete control. Just like we don&amp;rsquo;t allow car dealers to advertise $1 cars and then not have any available when a consumer arrives we should not allow companies like Comcast to take what is an open and useful tool and turn it into something they control. They benefitted form tax payer funded research into existing communications technologies and in exchange its not unreasonable to limit their ability to control what we have access to in our own homes. Its the same reasoning behind why Disney should not be allowed to extend copyright law. They benefitted from public domain in the creation of their works and so its only fair and logical that their works should be eventually returned to public domain.&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;br /&gt;
&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;
&lt;div&gt;The next post will show how I intend on responding. Any additional advise is welcome.&lt;/div&gt;&lt;div style="clear:both;"&gt;&lt;/div&gt;</description></item></channel></rss>