General

Re: Recommended non-libertarian forums?

John James — Sun, 03 Jun 2012 07:38:40 GMT

Austen:
http://www.debate.org/ is the best place to encounter ideological variation.

It's also a good place to plagiarize content from too, apparently.

Re: Recommended non-libertarian forums?

Austen — Sun, 03 Jun 2012 04:51:36 GMT

http://www.debate.org/ is the best place to encounter ideological variation.

Re: Recommended non-libertarian forums?

mustang19 — Sun, 03 Jun 2012 04:44:32 GMT

I haven't heard of policy mic. Looks interesting.

Re: Recommended non-libertarian forums?

Jon Collins — Sun, 03 Jun 2012 04:34:08 GMT

http://www.policymic.com/ is decent; there is a wide range of austrians, lefties, and everyone else inbetween on there and GENERALLY everyone is polite and respectful in their deliberations

Re: Recommended non-libertarian forums?

mustang19 — Sun, 03 Jun 2012 03:56:44 GMT

Not to mention, based on what they post and what you post, it seems like you'd fit right in. I assumed you were peas in a pod. Sure seems that way based on the positions you've taken here.

I post to create disagreement and fight mutual masturbation. What positions I have to adopt to accomplish this may or may not be my own. Besides, Ars isn't liberal enough for me.

Re: Recommended non-libertarian forums?

John James — Sun, 03 Jun 2012 03:40:55 GMT

mustang19:
"My" forum?

Well you seem to be constantly recommending it. It sounded to be your home forum. (You know, aside from golemlabs.) In fact the only reason I ever heard of it is because of your recommendation from somewhere on here.

Not to mention, based on what they post and what you post, it seems like you'd fit right in. I assumed you were peas in a pod. Sure seems that way based on the positions you've taken here.

Re: Recommended non-libertarian forums?

mustang19 — Sun, 03 Jun 2012 03:00:20 GMT

Maybe less outright insult in your forum, but as far as the ideological and intellectual content, I don't really see a difference.

"My" forum? I've already been permanently banned there twice.

Okay, maybe you're right about Ars. I'm still up for a raid though. It would be fun.

Unfortunately, OP, the internet is about as good a place to discuss politics as a dinner table. Try looking at some kind of scientific or philosophy forum where generally informed people seem to congregate. Phys.org has a forum and I don't think they're totally unfriendly to different views. 420chan /pol/ has a crazy variety of different viewpoints, although it can get stupid. Politicalfray.com might be another one.

Re: Recommended non-libertarian forums?

John James — Sun, 03 Jun 2012 02:42:57 GMT

mustang19:
It basically is like Revleft.

You been there? Ars?

Basically they insult the fuck out of you and you get banned if you respond in kind. However, there are one or two intelligent people there who stick to their points. Thing is, Revleft has always been a wacko place whereas Soapbox originally was not, and I don't think the mods are ideological enough to just straight out ban everyone who disagrees. If we swarm them with enough people, say 10 or 20, we could actually restore a bit of sanity and balanced debate. I'm up for joining the attack force if it means breaking up their circlejerk.

I couldn't tell when you were talking about your forum and when you were talking about Revleft, but it really doesn't matter because the discourse seems about the same. Maybe less outright insult in your forum, but as far as the ideological and intellectual content, I don't really see a difference. Certainly neither is a place "where there are libertarians, progressives, commies, conservatives and where there are some good dicussions and debates."

Re: Recommended non-libertarian forums?

mustang19 — Sun, 03 Jun 2012 01:40:09 GMT

Or is it just you think it's a synonym and you make it a point to use it because you think it makes you sound more educated and sophisticated, and as though you know more than ironically the use of that label proves that you actually have?

Not sure, and I really didn't put much thought into it. But it is great to know that mises.org agrees she's off the deep end.

It basically is like Revleft.

You been there? Ars?

Basically they insult the fuck out of you and you get banned if you respond in kind. However, there are one or two intelligent people there who stick to their points. Thing is, Revleft has always been a wacko place whereas Soapbox originally was not, and I don't think the mods are ideological enough to just straight out ban everyone who disagrees. If we swarm them with enough people, say 10 or 20, we could actually restore a bit of sanity and balanced debate. I'm up for joining the attack force if it means breaking up their circlejerk.

Re: Recommended non-libertarian forums?

John James — Sat, 02 Jun 2012 20:35:48 GMT

mustang19:
Sure, anything that isn't totally in line with Randian principles is going to seem like a liberal hive to yall,

Okay, what exactly is the obsession with Rand? They do this in the forum you recommend too. Is it just a total lack of understanding of the libertarian realm of political philosophy, and you actually think "Randian" is a more proper term? Or is it just you think it's a synonym and you make it a point to use it because you think it makes you sound more educated and sophisticated, and as though you know more than ironically the use of that label proves that you actually have?

but if you want to meet people with different opinions that can make at least a few semi-intelligent posts it's one place to go.

Ars Technica is essentially precisely what the OP says she wasn't looking for:

"I'm not talking about places like Revleft but forums where there are libertarians, progressives, commies, conservatives and where there are some good dicussions and debates."

It basically is like Revleft.

Re: Recommended non-libertarian forums?

mustang19 — Sat, 02 Jun 2012 11:45:54 GMT

Ars Technica is one of the better political discussion forums out there.

Sure, anything that isn't totally in line with Randian principles is going to seem like a liberal hive to yall, but if you want to meet people with different opinions that can make at least a few semi-intelligent posts it's one place to go.

Re: Recommended non-libertarian forums?

Jackson LaRose — Fri, 01 Jun 2012 20:29:50 GMT

Neodoxy:
Also Jackson, the top of the bell curve looks like people who aren't interested in politics, have no logical reasons for what they do believe, and are full to the brim with statist fallacies taught to them in school.

Sigh... Am I the only one looking forward to a super-hurricane?

Re: Recommended non-libertarian forums?

Neodoxy — Fri, 01 Jun 2012 18:52:06 GMT

That's exactly What I think every single time I look at most polical forums. Oh, also, favorite, and absolutely real, argument from the forum, from an ultra-conservative:

Paul is either extremely dumb, or closet Islamist, in any case he is a gift for Obama who can beat him laughing.

Bachmann is the last hope of GOP, only she can beat Obama!

EDIT

Also Jackson, the top of the bell curve looks like people who aren't interested in politics, have no logical reasons for what they do believe, and are full to the brim with statist fallacies taught to them in school.

Re: Recommended non-libertarian forums?

Jackson LaRose — Fri, 01 Jun 2012 18:46:02 GMT

LOL, and those are the people politically interested and passionate enought to join a forum about it! Imagine what the real top of the bell curve is like! Yuck!

Re: Recommended non-libertarian forums?

Neodoxy — Fri, 01 Jun 2012 18:26:07 GMT

"Sounds like Neverneverland. Or the Enchanted Forest."

No, I've been there and it's dominated by progressives.

"forums where there are libertarians, progressives, commies, conservatives and where there are some good dicussions and debates."

Okay... So I have a forum that has all of that ... Riight up until the last two requirements...

http://www.politicalforum.com/forum.php

The Good

This forum is huge, it has people of every viewpoint, creed, and interest
You can almost always find an interesting discussion
The forum tools are pretty decent
Because of the size of the forum you can find at least a single person of every political belief who ISN'T stupid
You will occasionally find decent discussion :D
You will learn the viewpoints of other people

The Bad

This forum is dominated be economic illiterates, half-wits, and people who are sooo certain that they have it exactly right
The right wingers will make you want to cut yourself from the colossal and unsurpassed level sheer stupidity (like seriously, some of the discussions revolving the more conservative people there left me with stupid arguments I will never, and can never forget)
The liberals there are (usually) not anywhere near as bad but for the most part don't know half of what they're actually talking about and they're still extremely pretentious about it. They think they're economics masters and much of their same logic arises from the same bull**** from whence the conservative's arise. They're certain that all companies which exist today are free market monopolies, every dollar which goes to Washington is spent feeding starving grandmothers or on essential roadways. I remember one champion whose favorite phrase was "tax cuts don't create jobs", his reasoning behind this being that then there was less consumption from people on welfare.
The socialists there are economic illiterates who material bomb more than anything in the world. They're stuck on basic economic facts and so nothing can ever be accomplished because, hey, in a world where one person hiring another means that the employee is being exploited and the capitalist is taking all his money, they're pretty much right! :D. I also remember that I couldn't for the life of me get this one socialist (who I had many encounters with while I was there, and who wasn't stupid he just made himself so through blind Marxism) who couldn't in any way wrap his head around the calculation argument. I had to tell him several times "I'm glad we aree that all technical processes don't disappear along with capitalism, that's not what I'm arguing". It's also the funniest and scariest thing in the world to see people on the radical left argue with one another.
The libertarians are generally good but there's a lot of what I like to call "derp" libertarians who just read some of Rothbard's work and quote everything he said, using no other definition and giving really crappy support. There's also a lot of really vehement Ron Paul supporters who don't really know too much about what they're talking about, but overall I would label them, from an unbiased perspective, the most overall intelligent minority in the forum. Absolute Voluntarist from that forum is one of the handful of posters who I will never forget from any forum because of the quality of his posts.
Most discussions break out into derp arguments pretty quickly
Everyone there is pretty assertive and so not much good discussion can happen in terms of converting/getting to other people
There's a lot more material bombing (just posting links of some kind or other) than actual rational argumentation

There's a reason why I left this forum, although I am tentatively considering returning now that I have more time on my hands (maybe we could go... Together! :D)

Nonetheless, it's a really good place for you to get in some good discussion while still seeing the amount of sheer idiocy that most people have, learning more about alternative ideological systems, and having a whole new dimension of a reason to disparage democracy! :D