Economics Questions

Re: Post-capitalist solutions: People's capitalism

The Late Andrew Ryan — Sat, 28 Nov 2009 01:52:33 GMT

Lo, tis the double post.

Re: Post-capitalist solutions: People's capitalism

The Late Andrew Ryan — Sat, 28 Nov 2009 01:52:27 GMT

Wanderer:

The Late Andrew Ryan:
Blug, too much reading. From what I read it seems like a possibility within 50 years. I fail to see exactly why he feels this is a new system rather than a natural evolution of the current one... How does he think capital should be distributed? The wall of text overwhelmed me at this late hour

50 years from now we'll be in a government-induced dark age. I doubt there'll be any kind of technological advances, unless they assist in killing, torturing, maiming, and spying on people.

Lol well aren't you the optimistic one?

,,,,Probably right though

Re: Post-capitalist solutions: People's capitalism

Andrew Cain — Fri, 27 Nov 2009 23:14:56 GMT

Justin Laws:

Isn't this something like Douglas Social Credit? http://douglassocialcredit.com/

Sounds like socialism.

It's socialism with technology.

Re: Post-capitalist solutions: People's capitalism

Justin Laws — Fri, 27 Nov 2009 23:07:46 GMT

Isn't this something like Douglas Social Credit? http://douglassocialcredit.com/

Sounds like socialism.

Re: Post-capitalist solutions: People's capitalism

Andrew Cain — Fri, 27 Nov 2009 22:53:35 GMT

Basic Concepts

A National Mutual Fund would be established to invest in private industry [ Socialism ]
These investments would be financed by loans from the Federal Reserve Bank [Socialism ]
Every adult U.S. citizen would be given a share of the National Mutual Fund [Socialism ]
Profits from National Mutual Fund investments would be distributed as dividends to the share holders. Everyone would receive dividends [ Socialism ]
In order to control inflation and finance part of the National Mutual Fund, savings would be levied as a surcharge on income taxes. These savings would pay interest and be guaranteed by the government [ Socialism ]

An exciting change is taking place. Socialism....with robots! It's the robots part which gives it the spiffy new car smell. Technocrats seem to be making a resurgence.

Re: Post-capitalist solutions: People's capitalism

Wanderer — Fri, 27 Nov 2009 06:47:53 GMT

The Late Andrew Ryan:
Blug, too much reading. From what I read it seems like a possibility within 50 years. I fail to see exactly why he feels this is a new system rather than a natural evolution of the current one... How does he think capital should be distributed? The wall of text overwhelmed me at this late hour

50 years from now we'll be in a government-induced dark age. I doubt there'll be any kind of technological advances, unless they assist in killing, torturing, maiming, and spying on people.

Re: Post-capitalist solutions: People's capitalism

thelion — Fri, 27 Nov 2009 06:19:37 GMT

I read several chapters, but Albus doesn't really understand subjective goods-character, because of his notion of going from output capitalism to storage capitalism, via elimination of "trivia."

In other words, you can have any color car, so long as its black (as Ford said). But what if I don't "want" black? Perhaps I won't buy his car. It has no value, then, and neither do the capital goods producing it. This is the major theoretical flaw.

Actually, Albus has been pretty successful with this idea politically. Look at his wikipedia.

Re: Post-capitalist solutions: People's capitalism

The Late Andrew Ryan — Fri, 27 Nov 2009 06:16:00 GMT

Blug, too much reading. From what I read it seems like a possibility within 50 years. I fail to see exactly why he feels this is a new system rather than a natural evolution of the current one... How does he think capital should be distributed? The wall of text overwhelmed me at this late hour

Re: Post-capitalist solutions: People's capitalism

thelion — Fri, 27 Nov 2009 06:07:22 GMT

It's not really weird, assuming we admit the initial assumption. Basically, the assumption is: robots replace all labour.

If so, then everyone simply owns robotics and, at least, receives income from ownership of capital goods. Then there are only capitalists, landowners, and entrepreneurs.

However, as far as experience today:

1) Automated processing machines which are very advanced today, on the other, hand are very capable of replacing labour. But they require a professional machinist to program the parameters for every fabrication job. It can't even be done via CAD; it has to be done on each machine. In other words, there is demand for higher-trained labour.

2) AI can pour a cup of coffee, without programmers. Maybe it can pour it without spilling it.

3) If I am a capitalist, but I engage in design of my robots, then I engage in labour. Which means that labour is still the major component of the economy. That is, unless robots can design themselves...

Post-capitalist solutions: People's capitalism

ivanfoofoo — Fri, 27 Nov 2009 05:21:53 GMT

http://www.peoplescapitalism.org/

Weird.