History

Re: Women were viewed as instruments of Satan by the Puritans?

John C — Sat, 11 Aug 2012 08:31:33 GMT

Searching more about, the Puritan viewed not the women as instruments of Satan, on the contrary, were viewed as "helpers". The Puritans understood that the wife and husband have their roles. The wife stayed at home for children. The husband toiled to sustain the wife and children. To women did not benefit working in traditionally male jobs.

Re: Women were viewed as instruments of Satan by the Puritans?

Kakugo — Wed, 08 Aug 2012 20:22:28 GMT

John C:

Dear Kakugo.

I haven't read Angelographia by Increase Mather. But I read The Wonders of the Invisible World. In this book, Cotton Mather was not referring to all women, but only to Witches and dishonest women. And "coercion from the devil" does not exist in book:
http://www.gutenberg.org/files/28513/28513-h/28513-h.htm

My bad, the term "coercion from the devil" was actually used by Carol Karlsen in Damned Women which deals exactly with the topic at hand.

Re: Women were viewed as instruments of Satan by the Puritans?

John C — Wed, 08 Aug 2012 06:19:35 GMT

Furthermore, during the Salem trials, men also were executed: John Willard, George Burroughs, George Jacobs, Sr. John Proctor and Samuel Wardwell. Then, was not a persecution to women. Was for religious issue.

Re: Women were viewed as instruments of Satan by the Puritans?

vive la insurrection — Mon, 06 Aug 2012 19:14:15 GMT

No citation = no concern....if he can't back up a very obvious research statement it's a hack job or just an informal piece of entertainment

Re: Women were viewed as instruments of Satan by the Puritans?

grant.w.underwood — Mon, 06 Aug 2012 17:46:45 GMT

youre right. im finding it difficult to find something along those lines, but to Rothbard's defense he does say in the very next paragraph that men were subject to it too. So Rothbard isnt saying that only women are instruments just that women are more likely to be.

This was a group of people that lived by the theory of original sin. 'While Adam was away, eve was made prey'.

Re: Women were viewed as instruments of Satan by the Puritans?

Lady Saiga — Mon, 06 Aug 2012 14:14:25 GMT

A woman's family is not her last line of defense. Her SELF is her last line of defense.

Re: Women were viewed as instruments of Satan by the Puritans?

John C — Mon, 06 Aug 2012 06:41:16 GMT

im confused... are you looking for a puritan who said the exact words "instruments of satan". Then i can understand the problem.

No exactly. I'm asking about some puritan writing of 17th century that imply that the women are instruments of Satan. On salem witch trials, were witches. And the penalities were not applicated only to women, men also were judged for sorcery, heresy.

Re: Women were viewed as instruments of Satan by the Puritans?

grant.w.underwood — Mon, 06 Aug 2012 04:57:15 GMT

im confused... are you looking for a puritan who said the exact words "instruments of satan". Then i can understand the problem.

but it sounds like you are thinking Puritans treated women equally? have you not stumbled across the salem witch trials yet? If i were to pick the personification of an 'instrument of satan' it would be a witch. Maybe siamese cats, but im leaning towards witches.

Re: Women were viewed as instruments of Satan by the Puritans?

John C — Mon, 06 Aug 2012 04:21:22 GMT

It is not discussion about demise of the family. I just asked a question: Murray Rothbard said that the puritans viewed women as "instruments of Satan". I haven't found none writing by none puritan in 17th century saying this. The puritans defended the family and the maidenlike. This is not misogyny. Is morality.

Re: Women were viewed as instruments of Satan by the Puritans?

DanielMuff — Mon, 06 Aug 2012 02:31:56 GMT

Certainly, one of the outcomes of the demise of the family is that a woman's family is now her friends; be it college friends, work office friends, or the "we are global citizens; therefore, everyone is my family." All the while, most of her guy friends (and some women, let's not be sexist) are simply waiting for an opportunity to move in on her.

She's given up her last line of defence against predators. Part of it because of the attitude against moving back home and, thus, being seen as a failure. But from I've seen, one of the virtues than keep elites elite is their unashamed kinship. Paris Hilton may be a slut and blow chunks of her trust fund, but she will always run back to her family when she is in danger.

Re: Women were viewed as instruments of Satan by the Puritans?

Clayton — Mon, 06 Aug 2012 01:27:52 GMT

I'll make some general remarks on this topic.

a) Historical rights should be analyzed relative to the contemporaneous alternatives... how were the rights of women protected in Puritan culture versus culture X? To do otherwise is to be guity of presentism.

b) Puritan culture was unabashedly patriarchal. Patriarchalism, in itself, is not aggressive despite the constant harping of the feminists to this effect. In fact, it is my view that patriarchalism is probably the most natural social order. It is only when patriarchalism is mixed with the State that it becomes coercive.

c) Modern Islam is constantly panned for its patriarchal practices. There is no doubt that wherever these are mixed with the aggressive power of the State, the outcome is deplorable. However, there actually are good reasons for patriarchal social order. One of the primary problems facing any social order is rape prevention. This is an aspect of security, generally.

One way to prevent your wife or daughters from being raped is to have them accompanied at all times by a bodyguard or security detail. But very few people can afford this kind of security. The other alternative to strongarm security is "out of sight, out of mind" - this is like when you stow your GPS in your glove compartment rather than leaving it on the dash. I think that telling your wife/daughters to "cover that shit up" is not a symptom of male jealous rage, as the feminists constantly suggest. Rather, it is a symptom of security concerns - "I can't afford a security detail for you guys so, when you go out of the house, cover that shit up!"

Clayton -

Re: Women were viewed as instruments of Satan by the Puritans?

John C — Mon, 06 Aug 2012 00:43:30 GMT

Dear Kakugo.

I haven't read Angelographia by Increase Mather. But I read The Wonders of the Invisible World. In this book, Cotton Mather was not referring to all women, but only to Witches and dishonest women. And "coercion from the devil" does not exist in book:
http://www.gutenberg.org/files/28513/28513-h/28513-h.htm

Re: Women were viewed as instruments of Satan by the Puritans?

Kakugo — Sun, 05 Aug 2012 15:06:09 GMT

I haven't read a whole lot of Puritan authors but Increase Mather (Cotton's father) wrote this in his Angelographia:

"If those White Angels appear to Females only, who are the weaker Sex, and more easy to be imposed on, that renders the case yet the more suspicious."

Also in The Wonders of the Invisible World, Cotton Mather makes various vague references abut women being more susceptible to "coercion from the devil". He didn't feel the need to quote his sources, probably because he was writing for an audience well-learned in Puritan culture.

Re: Women were viewed as instruments of Satan by the Puritans?

cab21 — Sun, 05 Aug 2012 09:29:03 GMT

men are the instruments of satan, the skin flute

http://www.womenhistoryblog.com/2007/10/puritan-women.html

Re: Women were viewed as instruments of Satan by the Puritans?

grant.w.underwood — Sun, 05 Aug 2012 09:20:01 GMT

to be serious, i dont think colonial puritans invented that. It dates back to adam and eve. So all of christian faith has that in their history. Puritans in England were pretty hardcore hence why they came to the colonies. So i would assume it would date long before the colonies, but colonial puritans took things to a bit too far.

men and women to puritans are born with original sin, but women (eve as proof) are easily corruptible by the devil. if you are saying rothbard had quotes around that exact sentence then i dont know. I hate reading history precivil war even if rothbard wrote it.