Political Theory

Re: I dont mean to bring up conspiracy thinking...

Michael S — Wed, 04 Feb 2009 04:41:19 GMT

liberty student:

Telpeurion:
I could have sworn that Austrian theory pretty much revolves around the notion that it is impossible to control such variable things as the actions of billions of people.

You're missing a couple things here. First, as stated, you are correct. But the idea is not to control the actions of billions of people, but to control their political choices, and thus the law and property rights. So while you are still able to choose what you buy in the marketplace more or less, your options in the political marketplace are completely controlled. And through the use of Central Banking combined with fiat money, your property rights can be eroded silently and with no transparency.

Is it a coincidence that every country in the world has a central bank? That every country has fiat money? That the central bank heads meet and collaborate, without any oversight from their own government or media?

Or is it a surprise that Bilderberg has met for decades, with media moguls in attendance, and it was never ever mentioned, let alone covered? The most powerful political and economic celebs get together, and no one in the media shows up to take one photo?

Now, I don't believe it is "the Jews" behind it, or the lizard people from another galaxy. But to assume that power attracts only the incompetent, and that power can never organize is foolish and naive. No one (intelligent) believes that Bush ran the US for the last 8 years. The man was barely capable of making toast for breakfast.

I don't think the "Jews" or the lizard people aka the "Dracos are behind it either. Saying that the "Jews" are behind it, is Jew baiting at it's finest. "jews are just the pawns like everyone else! Did you know that the "Jews" was the Popes Banker ever since there was a Pope? Source: http://www.vaticanassassins.org/

The thing that gets me about this alein thing is that there is a mayan painting with an alien beig in it, It's probably fake, or perhaps the painting is like any other painting-the Artists absract of something/reality or something. I have a Guayanese friend that believes some shape shifting people who live in the Center of the earth are responsible, no joke. she has a hard time believing that humans can be the cause of it.

Re: I dont mean to bring up conspiracy thinking...

Michael S — Wed, 04 Feb 2009 04:28:07 GMT

Conza88:

Schmitto2121:

I dont mean to bring up conspiracy thinking...But I am young, naive, and really dont know what to think about this NWO crap. heres a recent article http://www.chuckbaldwinlive.com/c2009/cbarchive_20090127.html

I was just very curious as to yalls personal opinions on this subject. Is it a bunch of B.S. or a serious threat to the future of our personal sovereignty?

The European Union. Does it exist? check.

The South American Union. Does it exist? check.

The North American Union. Does it exist? In the process.

The African Union. Does it exist? check.

The Asian Pacific Union. Does it exist? Soon. Diplomat appointed by PM Rudd of Australia working on it.

Look at all those nice trading blocs whose nations are losing complete national sovereignty. (Managed trade, not FREE trade) ;)

Better yet; possibility of world war 3? Pakistan vs India? US vs Iran/Syria/most of middle east, Israel vs Palestine, Russia vs Georgia again?, Indonesia was talking about going to support Hamas, etc.

Now ask yourselves this, what usually happens after World Wars?

World War 1: League of Nations
World War 2: United Nations
World War 3: One world government ??

:) I'd also suggest reading the Report from Iron Mountain - taken from Chp 24 in Creature from Jeykll Island.

It is pretty much exactly what is happening now. Lets just say, the climate change aka man made global warming movement... ain't really about saving the environment. ;)

Definite- "serious threat to the future of our personal sovereignty."

But the REAL beauty of the Austrian School of Economics is - you don't need to talk about the NWO scum to defeat them. You don't need to mention the conspiracy aspect at all. The NWO = tyranny. You don't need to convince people that there is a political and global elite who are behind the scences trying to make this happen.

All you need to do is convince people of LIBERTY. And the best way to do that is with the Austrian School of Economics.

You are right on Conza, I was thinking the same thing...

It's sad that People would rather feel all warm good and fuzzy inside then to know the truth. The problem is that the majority of people don't know that emotion exploitation is a 2000 plus years polititical/religion technique.Obama used this technique in his campaign using the words hope and change and change meaning a growing and more powerful goverment and then a world goverment. My point is that change is not always good lol!

Re: I dont mean to bring up conspiracy thinking...

Brainpolice — Tue, 03 Feb 2009 22:32:22 GMT

A conspiracy theory isn't necessary to establish the existance of power elites. The problem with many conspiracy theories is that they overcomplicate matters and try to reduce power elitism to an organization or two. This often ends up being too narrow - trying to reduce power elitism to a single group like "The Rothschilds", "The Jewish Bankers", "The NWO", "The Illuminati", and so on. A single group does not logically or logistically have the capability to single-handedly control the entire fate of everyone on the planet (an information problem exists).

Another point is that if people are able to figure it out to begin with, then obviously it's not much of a conspiracy, it's fairly out in the open.

Re: I dont mean to bring up conspiracy thinking...

hayekianxyz — Tue, 03 Feb 2009 22:25:21 GMT

krazy kaju:

It astonishes me that people who believe in the inefficiency in government actually have faith in the myth of governments around the world co-conspiring against their citizens.

I don't think anybody has claimed that the moment an individual begins to by employed by the government they become less efficient.

Re: I dont mean to bring up conspiracy thinking...

liege — Tue, 03 Feb 2009 05:02:25 GMT

krazy kaju:
It astonishes me that people who believe in the inefficiency in government actually have faith in the myth of governments around the world co-conspiring against their citizens.

Not every theory is based just on the government. Many of them have the government in league with powerful, private interests. Inefficiency arguments don't necessarily hold up under these conditions, since political clout is scarce and a market exists for it.

The problem with conspiracy theories is that we'll most likely never know in a timely manner just what is going on. I do think its funny though that ordinarily reasonable people will tell you that conspiracies don't exist anymore. That's right, parents don't conspire with each other to trick kids into believing in Santa Claus or the tooth fairy, public schools don't conspire to teach impressionable children that marijuana will kill them, etc.

Re: I dont mean to bring up conspiracy thinking...

liberty student — Tue, 03 Feb 2009 04:15:49 GMT

krazy kaju:

It astonishes me that people who believe in the inefficiency in government actually have faith in the myth of governments around the world co-conspiring against their citizens.

It's not a myth when it's admitted.

That doesn't mean every conspiracy theory is true, but there is plenty that is considered conspiracy theory, which is actually conspiracy fact.

Re: I dont mean to bring up conspiracy thinking...

liberty student — Tue, 03 Feb 2009 04:14:00 GMT

liege:

liberty student:
Now, I don't believe it is "the Jews" behind it, or the lizard people from another galaxy.

What about Jewish lizard people?

It could be the Mexican-Chinese Jews. I hadn't really considered them.

Re: I dont mean to bring up conspiracy thinking...

krazy kaju — Tue, 03 Feb 2009 02:01:22 GMT

It astonishes me that people who believe in the inefficiency in government actually have faith in the myth of governments around the world co-conspiring against their citizens.

Re: I dont mean to bring up conspiracy thinking...

Conza88 — Tue, 03 Feb 2009 01:55:11 GMT

Ixtellor:

YEA!!! Like that famous phone call to the Fed Reserve that is present on every conspiracy website in which the super smart caller calls up the Fed President and gets him to admit to all your accusations.

Oh wait... That phone call was never confirmed... and even the guy who made it admitted he didn't record it. He "wrote down" his recollections after this supposed phone call took place. AWSOME source!!!

Did you mean those buried stories?

Democrats and Republicans have entire cadres of opposition research employees who spend their whole careers trying to catch each other in every and any major/minor infraction, but I guess EVERY single one of them is part of this VAST conspiracy by Jewish bankers.

Quick question, WTF are you talking about?

Ixtellor:
My favorite response was from Conza88.

The 8th letter of the alphabet is H.

88 = HH = Hail Hitler.

Shocking that a guy who "Hails Hitler" Would think that there is an international banking conspiracy. I can only guess who is behind it all.... $1000 bucks says your a holocost denier.

Ixtellor

P.S. Yes Yes, I realized I used a logical fallacy, by dismissing the Hail Hitler guy. I guess I am just an ignorant zionist propagandizer who can't see the truth.

At the moment I am struggling to find the words that accurately portray how much of a failure you are. I guess we'll just leave your completely irrational actions to speak for themselves.

I was born in 1988. And didn't realise the neo nazi's worshiped the number. It's been my handle on othersites, so I kept it. Accusing me of being a collectivist, is like accusing Keynes of being an economist. It's totally absurd. Furthermore, I assume you are older than me... so how about you start acting like an adult, instead of a child. That might help your attempted 'responses'.

As for my argument, it still stands, completely UNSCATHED by your "assault".

I think its rather obvious, you have no logical coherent response, so you resulted to an emotional one. Figures, must be those Keyesian animal spirits!

Re: I dont mean to bring up conspiracy thinking...

hayekianxyz — Mon, 02 Feb 2009 22:58:20 GMT

Ixtellor:
P.S. Yes Yes, I realized I used a logical fallacy, by dismissing the Hail Hitler guy. I guess I am just an ignorant zionist propagandizer who can't see the truth.

Now don't be getting all defensive on us...

Re: I dont mean to bring up conspiracy thinking...

Ixtellor — Mon, 02 Feb 2009 22:54:26 GMT

liberty student:

Lots of people have come forward. It's just buried or under-reported. And no, I am not going to waste time digging it up. You can google for this stuff, a lot of it is out there. Lies, speculation and the truth.

YEA!!! Like that famous phone call to the Fed Reserve that is present on every conspiracy website in which the super smart caller calls up the Fed President and gets him to admit to all your accusations.

Oh wait... That phone call was never confirmed... and even the guy who made it admitted he didn't record it. He "wrote down" his recollections after this supposed phone call took place. AWSOME source!!!

Did you mean those buried stories?

Democrats and Republicans have entire cadres of opposition research employees who spend their whole careers trying to catch each other in every and any major/minor infraction, but I guess EVERY single one of them is part of this VAST conspiracy by Jewish bankers.

My favorite response was from Conza88.

The 8th letter of the alphabet is H.

88 = HH = Hail Hitler.

Shocking that a guy who "Hails Hitler" Would think that there is an international banking conspiracy. I can only guess who is behind it all.... $1000 bucks says your a holocost denier.

Ixtellor

P.S. Yes Yes, I realized I used a logical fallacy, by dismissing the Hail Hitler guy. I guess I am just an ignorant zionist propagandizer who can't see the truth.

Re: I dont mean to bring up conspiracy thinking...

liege — Fri, 30 Jan 2009 17:17:19 GMT

liberty student:
Now, I don't believe it is "the Jews" behind it, or the lizard people from another galaxy.

What about Jewish lizard people?

Re: I dont mean to bring up conspiracy thinking...

Conza88 — Fri, 30 Jan 2009 16:26:24 GMT

Jon Irenicus:

Ireland is part of the union.

Yes, otherwise why would they be voting on the Lisbon Treaty, which is a continuation of the Amsterdam and Nice treaties.

Instead of "joining the Union", I should have said: "further political union" - i.e adopting the European Constitution, as the countries system of supreme law.

"The decision places massive doubt over the future of the pact designed to bring more European integration.

All 27 European member states have to ratify the treaty for it to go come into force next year. So far it has been approved by 18 members including Britain, but Ireland is the only country to put it to a public vote.

The leaders of the 26 other member states watched with dismay as Ireland voted “no”, a decision that will inevitably lead to much infighting and bickering across Europe." Link.

The day the Ireland public voted "No", was a great day for Liberty and humanity. Thanks for pointing that out btw.

(Please visit the site to view this media)

Re: I dont mean to bring up conspiracy thinking...

Jon Irenicus — Fri, 30 Jan 2009 13:52:07 GMT

Ireland is part of the union.

Re: I dont mean to bring up conspiracy thinking...

Conza88 — Fri, 30 Jan 2009 08:09:59 GMT

Ixtellor:

To have a viable conspiracy theory you have to have two criteria.
1) Someone has a goal of achieving X. (in this case NWO)
2) They are hiding, conspiring, their true agenda.

1) Do you watch the news? Practically every leader world wide has suddenly started to call for a 'New World Order', Sarkozy and others want a new international financial system with a world central bank... Not sure how that fufills hidden agenda, it's all coming out not, because they are just about to "solve" this "crisis".

2) It's blatant... and if you didn't prefer to remain ignorant, and actually attempted to research ANY of this, that much would be clear.

Ixtellor:

I think occam's razor is a great tool for the NWO theories.

Which is more plausible.

1) A group of men spanning generations have slowly been conspiring to create a NWO using a series of small steps over hundreds of years, rather than just go to war. And they have successfully kept the population of the earth in the dark to their true agenda, and not one single member of this elite cadre has ever come forward, even thought it would make them arguable the most famous and potentially powerful people on earth.

or

2) Things like NAFTA occur because of the belief they will be economically beneficial. That the EU formed as a way to gain competitive advantages over larger global economic powers like the USA and China.

1) They have. Never heard of Cecil Rhodes? The Fabian society? Haha. Geez, you've got a long way to go buddy. Ohh oops, forgot you're a Keynesian.

* Specifically: Future is Calling by G. Edward Griffin pg 43+

2) It is managed trade, not Free Trade. Ever heard of the Nice Treaty? How about the Lisbon Treaty? Irish voters - voting for the ENTIRE population of the Eurpeon Union (550million people) - because their countries refused to allow a referendum on the matter. Yet after it is rejected for the 2nd time! The elite continue to try shuv it down the throat of all involved. They will not stop until Ireland is part of the Union, it doesn't matter what the people say, they won't even ask the people, nor do they care! You don't think thats a blatant conspiracy against the people? Righhhht, I spouse the politicans care about their voters and do what the majority wishes, no matter what. Hmmm pity, I thought most of America (70%) wanted the war in Iraq to be over... yet it still goes on.

What's further obvious and profoundly sad, is that you refused to address any of my previous points - or even approach the matter with an open mind, subject to reason. Read the material, it comes from PRIMARY sources, until then - enjoy ignorance.