Political Theory

Re: Cato Letter to Obama

Conza88 — Tue, 03 Feb 2009 02:13:35 GMT

M-la-maudite:

From memory (you can find the entire list on Cato's website): J.M. Buchanan (who i personally consider the biggest libertarian economist still alive) and Walter Block have signed it ! I guess you wouldn't suspect either of them of pro-establishment biais...

And David Boaz has written some pretty good (libertarian) academic literature; so, contempt might be a bit excessive, even if he is not always right.

Conza88:
Oh I missed those names mentioned. They've simply signed on. It doesn't change what the Cato Institute represents in the slightest.That would involve replacing those inept and flawed at the top.

It's just a showboat exercise. Hopefully it actually packs a punch, but it won't do anything to mould policy. What's the difference though? BUSH was doing the EXACT same things! Then they make some kind of big deal about it now? Get your hand off it, nothings changed - this again, just gives the perception of it.

Re: Cato Letter to Obama

M-la-maudite — Mon, 02 Feb 2009 23:08:11 GMT

Conza88:

M-la-maudite:

Conza, if you read the actual list of signatories (which is pretty impressive, btw), you'll notice staunch consistent libertarians who surely aren't from any of the parties -;)

Not sure who you are referring to in terms of staunch libertarians. None of those names seem to stand out, or ring a bell.

From memory (you can find the entire list on Cato's website): J.M. Buchanan (who i personally consider the biggest libertarian economist still alive) and Walter Block have signed it ! I guess you wouldn't suspect either of them of pro-establishment biais...

And David Boaz has written some pretty good (libertarian) academic literature; so, contempt might be a bit excessive, even if he is not always right.

Re: Cato Letter to Obama

Conza88 — Sun, 01 Feb 2009 02:05:22 GMT

ryanpatgray:
Quite frankly this sounds like a hurt mother who's son wan't picked for the baseball team. It sounds personal and not issue oriented.

The issues: Liberty, Truth, Peace and Prosperity. The problem, CATO didn't support them when it really mattered and could have actually made a difference. The showed their true colors.

Re: Cato Letter to Obama

ryanpatgray — Sat, 31 Jan 2009 19:29:41 GMT

Conza88:
Not sure what you mean by that? They stonewalled everything the rEVOLution represents. Ignored and geered Ron Paul. He didn't exist to them. They did a peice on political candidates, looking at Obama and McCain - although Paul was still in the race. No mention of him in all their articles, they considered him dead.

Quite frankly this sounds like a hurt mother who's son wan't picked for the baseball team. It sounds personal and not issue oriented.

Re: Cato Letter to Obama

Conza88 — Sat, 31 Jan 2009 05:42:58 GMT

ryanpatgray:

Conza88:

This sums up my feelings very nicely. I canceled my subscription to CATO afterwards. I have nothing but contempt for these people. They are not real advocates of Liberty, truth and freedom. They just present themselves as such. Nothing comes close to the LvMI.

So because they criticized a single person you have repect for they are the enemy?

Not sure what you mean by that? They stonewalled everything the rEVOLution represents. Ignored and geered Ron Paul. He didn't exist to them. They did a peice on political candidates, looking at Obama and McCain - although Paul was still in the race. No mention of him in all their articles, they considered him dead.

I have no respect for them, for they don't represent Liberty at all. Their little peice is all show.

http://www.antiwar.com/blog/2005/09/23/the-war-party-conquers-cato/

Nerditarian:

Review it again. Looking quickly there's Walter Block(a staunch libertarian if there ever was one). Bruce Benson(wrote those books on anarcho-capitalist law, no?). James Buchanan(Maybe not staunch, but you can't challenge him as far as Minarchists go, he's pretty damn good). Art Carden (see his Mises Daily articles). Bryan Caplan(The Myth of the Rational Voter). Michele Boldrine, who wrote that intellectual property book. I'm not sure what the rest of her politics is but I'm pretty sure she's one of the good guys. In addition I was only checking the first column. I'm sure there's a lot more.

Oh I missed those names mentioned. They've simply signed on. It doesn't change what the Cato Institute represents in the slightest.That would involve replacing those inept and flawed at the top.

It's just a showboat exercise. Hopefully it actually packs a punch, but it won't do anything to mould policy. What's the difference though? BUSH was doing the EXACT same things! Then they make some kind of big deal about it now? Get your hand off it, nothings changed - this again, just gives the perception of it.

Re: Cato Letter to Obama

Nerditarian — Sat, 31 Jan 2009 04:59:43 GMT

Conza88:
Not sure who you are referring to in terms of staunch libertarians. None of those names seem to stand out, or ring a bell.

Review it again. Looking quickly there's Walter Block(a staunch libertarian if there ever was one). Bruce Benson(wrote those books on anarcho-capitalist law, no?). James Buchanan(Maybe not staunch, but you can't challenge him as far as Minarchists go, he's pretty damn good). Art Carden (see his Mises Daily articles). Bryan Caplan(The Myth of the Rational Voter). Michele Boldrine, who wrote that intellectual property book. I'm not sure what the rest of her politics is but I'm pretty sure she's one of the good guys. In addition I was only checking the first column. I'm sure there's a lot more.

Re: Cato Letter to Obama

ryanpatgray — Sat, 31 Jan 2009 02:32:09 GMT

Conza88:

This sums up my feelings very nicely. I canceled my subscription to CATO afterwards. I have nothing but contempt for these people. They are not real advocates of Liberty, truth and freedom. They just present themselves as such. Nothing comes close to the LvMI.

So because they criticized a single person you have repect for they are the enemy?

Re: Cato Letter to Obama

nazgulnarsil — Sat, 31 Jan 2009 02:18:38 GMT

Let's think about this logically for a minute. You are a statist politician. You and your constiuents are getting a piece of the pie. After all, turning yourself into a Kucinich isn't going to stop the Leviathan. Why not get your piece and be content with that? Everyone who tries to stop the inexorably advancing state gets crushed.

Everyone is just an opportunist.

Re: Cato Letter to Obama

Conza88 — Sat, 31 Jan 2009 02:01:15 GMT

M-la-maudite:

Interesting initiative; i'd hope i'd be able to say "let's hope that it'll be taken into consideration by the new powers-that-be" but, well, too cynical about real-life politics to value anything else than the symbolic worth of this protest...

Conza, if you read the actual list of signatories (which is pretty impressive, btw), you'll notice staunch consistent libertarians who surely aren't from any of the parties -;)

Not sure who you are referring to in terms of staunch libertarians. None of those names seem to stand out, or ring a bell.

Cato is an absolute joke though. Nothing from them should be taken seriously. They are in Washington for a reason, and they sold out ages ago.

Dear Cato Institute and David Boaz: Thanks for Nothing

Anyone who knows my politics knows the esteem I have for Boaz, the Cato Institute, and most other classically liberal names or institutions you can chuck up. So, it is with an especially heavy heart that I weave this critical narrative. The title alludes that David Boaz did nothing for the last installment of the liberty movement ala “Ron Paul Revolution”, but that isn’t exactly true. Instead, I think Boaz smacked liberty back a notch with this strange post on the CATO Institutes’s blog. But first, a primer:

Congressman Ronald Paul came to the 2008 Presidential elections with no money, no campaign infrastructure, and no name recognition. He arrived with only an idea, but his idea compelled hundreds of thousands of Americans to donate over $32 million and create the largest grassroots movement in history. College students gave up their entire Christmas breaks to sleep in cold New Hampshire cabins and canvas for 16-hour days. Quick-witted Texas judges held signs at conventions and out-smarted the likes of Hugh Hewitt. People like me spent hours trying to explain the more esoteric aspects of a Paul presidency for the masses.

This sums up my feelings very nicely. I canceled my subscription to CATO afterwards. I have nothing but contempt for these people. They are not real advocates of Liberty, truth and freedom. They just present themselves as such. Nothing comes close to the LvMI.

Re: Cato Letter to Obama

Nitroadict — Fri, 30 Jan 2009 22:01:21 GMT

ryanpatgray:

Nitroadict:

laminustacitus:

Conza88:
It's the exact same with Glen Beck on Fox News... ALL of a sudden, when it doesn't matter anymore (election is over) - you get Glen Beck doing an Al Gore hockey stick on the increase of the money supply because of the Fed.

In all honesty, this isn't true. Surely, Glenn Beck may be horrendous on other issues, but, with the economy, he is usually correct. Plus, Glenn Beck gave Ron Paul a great interview last year, and largely agreed with what Paul was advocating.

I don't understand why the sudden sympathy for GB, especially at TheLibertyPapers. He obviously found he got more ratings being the libertarian sympathizer foil to the what will surely be a massive increase of The State in the next decade. To me, it seems he's merely found a better target audience, & more effective source of ratings, in the market.

If he had Penn Gillete on his show more often, & heard the label of anarcho-capitalism on air more than once, maybe I could venture beyond cynicism, but otherwise, a pundit is still a pundit.

I have listened to him for almost ten years. His shift has been gradual over time. I do think it is a genuine shift in POV and not a ratings gimmick. Sure, he is not a pure Rothbardian but he has definite libertarian leanings which is a good thing considering he is the third most listened to radio talk show host in the United States. We should be glad he is there but encouraging him to read more libertarian literature, we should not be chiding him for being one of the most libertarian talk show hosts (with the exceptions of FTL and Boortz).

I am more skeptical, but I too have noticed such a shift in his tone & attitude. Apparently, accounts from individuals who've met with him offline (that I've read on various forums via goggling) have more or less confirmed that his shift is genuine.

I wasn't chiding him for such a shift, merely positing to take it all in context, as the rest of the media has already, within a week or two of Obama's inception, been signaling they will throw away their memory of being unquestioned status-quo advocates & will "reform" their own image as being "real" reporters when it comes to this administration (predictable, of course, but sickening every time it happens).

Regardless, he is good at what he does; I'm dissapointed he wasn't able to stick around on MSNBC & provide an interesting counter to Olberman, but I barley watch the "news" (propoganda / advertising) as it is so :shrug:

Re: Cato Letter to Obama

ryanpatgray — Fri, 30 Jan 2009 21:52:32 GMT

Nitroadict:

laminustacitus:

Conza88:
It's the exact same with Glen Beck on Fox News... ALL of a sudden, when it doesn't matter anymore (election is over) - you get Glen Beck doing an Al Gore hockey stick on the increase of the money supply because of the Fed.

In all honesty, this isn't true. Surely, Glenn Beck may be horrendous on other issues, but, with the economy, he is usually correct. Plus, Glenn Beck gave Ron Paul a great interview last year, and largely agreed with what Paul was advocating.

I don't understand why the sudden sympathy for GB, especially at TheLibertyPapers. He obviously found he got more ratings being the libertarian sympathizer foil to the what will surely be a massive increase of The State in the next decade. To me, it seems he's merely found a better target audience, & more effective source of ratings, in the market.

If he had Penn Gillete on his show more often, & heard the label of anarcho-capitalism on air more than once, maybe I could venture beyond cynicism, but otherwise, a pundit is still a pundit.

I have listened to him for almost ten years. His shift has been gradual over time. I do think it is a genuine shift in POV and not a ratings gimmick. Sure, he is not a pure Rothbardian but he has definite libertarian leanings which is a good thing considering he is the third most listened to radio talk show host in the United States. We should be glad he is there but encouraging him to read more libertarian literature, we should not be chiding him for being one of the most libertarian talk show hosts (with the exceptions of FTL and Boortz).

Re: Cato Letter to Obama

Nitroadict — Fri, 30 Jan 2009 21:42:19 GMT

laminustacitus:

Conza88:
It's the exact same with Glen Beck on Fox News... ALL of a sudden, when it doesn't matter anymore (election is over) - you get Glen Beck doing an Al Gore hockey stick on the increase of the money supply because of the Fed.

In all honesty, this isn't true. Surely, Glenn Beck may be horrendous on other issues, but, with the economy, he is usually correct. Plus, Glenn Beck gave Ron Paul a great interview last year, and largely agreed with what Paul was advocating.

I don't understand why the sudden sympathy for GB, especially at TheLibertyPapers. He obviously found he got more ratings being the libertarian sympathizer foil to the what will surley be a massive increase of The State in the next decade. To me, it seems he's merley found a better target audience, & more effective source of ratings, in the market.

If he had Penn Gillete on his show more often, & heard the label of anarcho-capitalism on air more than once, maybe I could venture beyond cynicism, but otherwise, a pundit is still a pundit.

Re: Cato Letter to Obama

ryanpatgray — Fri, 30 Jan 2009 20:13:37 GMT

Conza88:
It's the exact same with Glen Beck on Fox News... ALL of a sudden, when it doesn't matter anymore (election is over) - you get Glen Beck doing an Al Gore hockey stick on the increase of the money supply because of the Fed.

Glenn Beck has been against inflating the money supply long before the election and long before he had a show on either Fox or CNN.

Re: Cato Letter to Obama

laminustacitus — Fri, 30 Jan 2009 17:53:17 GMT

Conza88:
It's the exact same with Glen Beck on Fox News... ALL of a sudden, when it doesn't matter anymore (election is over) - you get Glen Beck doing an Al Gore hockey stick on the increase of the money supply because of the Fed.

In all honesty, this isn't true. Surely, Glenn Beck may be horrendous on other issues, but, with the economy, he is usually correct. Plus, Glenn Beck gave Ron Paul a great interview last year, and largely agreed with what Paul was advocating.

Re: Cato Letter to Obama

M-la-maudite — Fri, 30 Jan 2009 17:34:43 GMT

Interesting initiative; i'd hope i'd be able to say "let's hope that it'll be taken into consideration by the new powers-that-be" but, well, too cynical about real-life politics to value anything else than the symbolic worth of this protest...

Conza, if you read the actual list of signatories (which is pretty impressive, btw), you'll notice staunch consistent libertarians who surely aren't from any of the parties -;)