It sure doesn't look like a very libertarian crowd out there to support Rand Paul... but then, that makes sense, because hardly any of Rand Paul's positions are truly libertarian.
In fact, in two-party American politics, libertarian ideology's only function is to provide a justification for removing any government programs aimed helping the underdog (i.e., the Civil Rights Act, welfare, social security, Medicare, OSHA, minimum wage laws, public works projects etc), while of course these same "small government" politicians always ignore any government programs which benefit the top dogs (i.e., the Pentagon budget, corporate personhood, private prisons, corporate fee-based health-care etc.)
These Rand Paul supporters seem to get it, which is probably why they're so enthusistically stomping on someone smaller and weaker than them!
LEXINGTON, Ky. – Supporters of Republican U.S. Senate candidate Rand Paul wrestled a woman to the ground and one stepped on her head after she tried to confront the candidate in Kentucky.
The incident happened Monday night in Lexington right before a debate between Paul and Democratic opponent Jack Conway.
Lauren Valle of liberal group MoveOn.org, told Louisville station WDRB she was trying to give Paul a fake award when his supporters took her to the ground.
Television footage shows Valle's blonde wig being pulled off before she's pinned to the ground. A man then puts his foot down on her head. Valle said the incident left her with "a bit of a headache."
A police watch commander said early Tuesday [of course] that she didn't know if any arrests were made [despite the perps face being fully visible on camera]...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DNYtTYb9V5g
1) So what's the context here? Why did she get that treatment?
2) It might be faked. It wouldn't surprise me.
"the one thing I really admired [Bunning] was that he wasn't afraid to stand on principle."
Untermenschen who cannot compete on the market deserve no sympathy! Our principles are our boots on their faces, forever!
How are you going to post this, right as I am posting the same thing?
I should curb stomp you man! (joke)
In States a fresh law is looked upon as a remedy for evil. Instead of themselves altering what is bad, people begin by demanding a law to alter it. ... In short, a law everywhere and for everything!
~Peter Kropotkin
Ravochol is lost again... he keeps getting mises.org confused with his personal blog. Still waiting on that debate.org challenge.
She came to give Rand Paul a "Republi-corp employee of the month award." THat's all.
For the record, in a government created crisis, the government is very much liable to the unemployed.
At the very least, it's the unemployed getting their money back that they paid in the form of inflation, sales tax, income tax, employer's payroll tax, and so on. Less than that, actually.
The amount set aside for it was far far less than what was put in for TARP, which created a moral hazard with depositor's money far more dangerous than short-term unemployment insurance.
No, it's not that they don't deserve help. It's that it is immoral to steal from others to give to them. Doing this opens the door for even more moral hazard and more social democracy.
"more social democracy."
heaven forbid! Then we'd turn into a poor third-world nation, like Germany!
(Or even Switzerland!)
If Germany was such a social democracy you'd think that people would be running amok on the streets as a result of spending cuts by the government. The truth is, Germans are different from French people who are different from Greeks who are different from the Brits who are different from the Americans. The Germans I know don't pride themselves or their country on redistributing things to poor people, but on a sense of industry and needing to contribute. Depending on the values of the society, social democracy might be more tanable than in other nations, but it still doesn't last in the long run because:
“A democracy is always temporary in nature; it simply cannot exist as a permanent form of government. A democracy will continue to exist up until the time that voters discover that they can vote themselves generous gifts from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates who promise the most benefits from the public treasury, with the result that every democracy will finally collapse due to loose fiscal policy, which is always followed by a dictatorship.”
-Alexander Fraser Tytler
Essentially, everyone discovers that they have the right to steal from everyone else. Is this the society we should live in? Where no one has a definite claim to any property?
Switzerland more closely resembles a voluntary association than a government. Luxembourg and Singapore even more so... These are libertarian victories.
It's them getting their own money back, GiantJoe.
Inflationary policies have a regressive effect that hit the lower fixed income earners the hardest, not just in the form of reduced purchasing power but the depletion of scarce capital of businesses that employ them. Their employers also have to make them work longer for less pay, because of the payroll taxes borne by the employer.
At least under the former conditions, when good labour gets more expensive, employers tend to bear it in the form of bad labour for the same price. One of the good qualities of an employee is honesty, and it becomes more typical for dishonest people to work for the same wages under inflation and other regressive means of collecting incomes. It's a cost borne in the form of rotten values of all people in general.
Even if unemployment insurance does create a moral hazard to remain unemployed, it's a reversal of the cost of getting worse quality people for the same pay.
This love affair with Germany is all very common with some people far away in USA. If you actually knew more about Germany you would realise some interesting facts, like the fact that the German states that have more "Social Democracy" are also the poorer ones. If you want to focus on more purest Social Democracies then focus on countries like Spain or France first. Germany has problems but is nowhere near as your utopian ideals.
What makes me sick about Germany is that everyone attributes its relative success to their own pet theories.
"Untermenschen who cannot compete on the market deserve no sympathy! Our principles are our boots on their faces, forever!"
It's your belief, not ours, that there are subhumans amongst us. Also: If you resist the state, you will get a boot in your face. The principle of all statism is boot to the face, if you resist. All statism requires lots of prisons and not to mention wars, both of which, I assure you, will involve boot stomping. Much more than the random incidents -- having to do with politics, not the market or voluntarism -- like this one at a Rand Paul gathering.
Imagine yourself in a marriage. Which would you rather be in: one where you each buy each other things on the threat of being murdered if not... or one that is based on the actual want to give things? There is a big difference. And it is two separate principles, even if both involve exchanges. Just as it is two separate principles for a woman to defend herself with force against those that would force her to have sex, versus a man who wants sex and uses force in order to get what he wants.
I wouldn't be surprised if this were a staged event, i.e. those alleged "Rand Paul supporters" were nothing of the sort.
The keyboard is mightier than the gun.
Non parit potestas ipsius auctoritatem.
Voluntaryism Forum
I still don't understand giving Paul the "RepubliCorp" award, considering he has not been elected to anything and so has not crafted nor voted on any legislation.
It's your belief, not ours, that there are subhumans amongst us.
It's the bass-ackwards progressivist ideology: we must celebrate how much we can pamper people, and we must celebrate how we smash the successful people to reach this end! Those who have the ability to excel must be handicapped. Being better than anyone by any measure is evil!
A society that worships those who can only get by on charity is a society in decline.
"I still don't understand giving Paul the "RepubliCorp" award, considering he has not been elected to anything and so has not crafted nor voted on any legislation."
I think it's the same reason they probably don't even look at the voting record of Democrats and so also create a Democorp award. They don't really care about empiricism or the facts of politics. But just the LOLz for their blog or some knee-jerk reaction.
Well now I'm not as upset about her head getting stomped on.
EDIT:
Moved out of graveyard.
This is weird.
Clayton -
Valle said the incident left her with "a bit of a headache."
OH THE HORROR!!!
I love how progressives are so terrified of the real free-marketeers (and Rand Paul is more closely aligned with that than most Republicans, anyway). Then they show their true socialist side when they freak out and wail that the Paul family are corporate shills.
Anyway, what I like about that type of debate is that it shifts the two-party paradigm into more philosophical territory where you can engage in political theory and not Maddow/Hannity soundbite wars.
Ravochol: "... but then, that makes sense, because hardly any of Rand Paul's positions are truly libertarian."
Tru dat!
To paraphrase Marc Faber: We're all doomed, but that doesn't mean that we can't make money in the process. Rabbi Lapin: "Let's make bricks!" Stephan Kinsella: "Say you and I both want to make a German chocolate cake."
ravochol: "more social democracy." heaven forbid! Then we'd turn into a poor third-world nation, like Germany!
Interpersonal utility comparison fail.
The horribly ironic and hypocritical thing about the assault was that the guy who stomped her was wearing a "Don't Tread on Me" badge:
^ that's funny and sad at the same time
I saw Rand Paul on TV the other day. He seems very unclear about his own opinions about things.
Even the war, something his father is very clear about, presents difficulty for him. He seems to know that 'nation building' isn't something we should do, but won't out and out say that the war is wrong and that we should bring the troops back. I don't think he even says it is a failure. Like some of the dodges about 'creationism' in the schools he falls back on 'having debates' or 'living it open'. When it is very clear people just want his own opinion and moral judgment about it. Not what how he thinks it will be resolved.
I'm not sure about his other positions. I suspect you have to lose your spine to get in the mass tea party movement. And go more towards the right on cultural issues. Which is a shame.
Though, there are certainly worse people out there to spend your time making fun of. This guy isn't even in office; as I said, empiricism is everything. If he did something, fine, but until then it seems like a stretch to say he is worse than a whole congress and senate who are, for the most part, out of their minds with corruption.
Tea party, strike 1. Other parties, strike 100 million.
Ravochol,
Are you saying that ending Social Security(even if nothing else was touched) would not be a good thing?
Peace
Dude, Bunning was just saying take the unemployment benefits money from the unspent TARP or stimulus funds.
Guys, if you don't understand horse-race two-party current events politics, then don't talk about it.
NewLiberty: Dude, Bunning was just saying take the unemployment benefits money from the unspent TARP or stimulus funds. Guys, if you don't understand horse-race two-party current events politics, then don't talk about it.
RIght, because never talking about something is a great way to learn to understand it.
There's nothing compassionate or libertarian about paying people not to work, with other people's stolen money. In fact, it creates arbitrary rigidities in the labor market, elevates the unemployment rate (people prefer leisure to labor), and creates an additional incentive to inflate.
"If we wish to preserve a free society, it is essential that we recognize that the desirability of a particular object is not sufficient justification for the use of coercion."
Charles Johnson WINGNUTS • Tue Oct 26, 2010 at 1:08 pm PDT • Views: 3,231
http://littlegreenfootballs.com/article/37446_Right_Wing_Bloggers_on_Stomping-_It_Was_Faked_It_Was_Staged_She_Deserved_It
I don’t want to believe the ugly comments at almost every right wing blog about the woman assaulted by Rand Paul supporters last night. Has the entire wingnut blogosphere turned into a pack of rabid animals?
Jim “Dim” Hoft thinks Lauren Valle deserved to be stomped on the head, and he’s digging into her background to prove it: UNHINGED LEFTIST Who Lunged at Rand Paul Is Paid Far Left Activist.
Ann Althouse immediately tried to claim the incident was staged: Finally some good news for Democrats.
And then there’s Free Republic:
The left gets a taste of their own medicine. Sorry, at this point I have no pity…I’d like to stomp a few myself… […] My thoughts are there is a smelly rat involved. We all know how much they lie. […] per the photo - it’s on her upper back / shoulder area as to contain her… I love it whent he leftist cry like little babies when they don’t get their way - and the press writes this article as if completely shocked… The media and the socialist need to grow up - this isn’t 6th grade anymore…adult US citizens have had enough of glorified hollywood types fromt eh media and other org’s like Move On telling them what’s best for them… she got exactly what she dished out - […] A whole lot more of the commies should be on the ground bleeding….. […] She was in disguise and attempted to approach Rand Paul. How would they know her intent? They should have stripped her down to make sure she didn’t have a bomb or gun on her. […] Clearly a case of assault with intent… this bitch was a hit bitch from soros. I hope she suffered some sort of permanent damage. […] Lets see….she is a liberal so she is already a) Ugly, and 2) brain damaged. I can’t figure out what more you can do to liberals other than driving a stake through their heart and setting them on fire in the sunlight. […] I dont have a problem with this… I dont F’ing care if the leftists do… Honestly, Im game for putting any leftist POS who even thinks about acting stupid in the GD hospital. It is NOT our fault it had to come to this. but it HAS come to this and its our duty to MAKE them understand that its in their best interests to go the F away. We have always been able to put these people down but have shied away from it because we know that once we start to cross that bridge we have to go all the way. We gave up A LOT to avoid this from happening but the F’ers just kept on pushing… Now they have pushed us onto that bridge and we ARE going to cross it. Enough is enough… Act like a F’ing IDIOT at your own peril. […] I’d have shot the b**** and been done with it.
The left gets a taste of their own medicine. Sorry, at this point I have no pity…I’d like to stomp a few myself…
[…]
My thoughts are there is a smelly rat involved. We all know how much they lie.
per the photo - it’s on her upper back / shoulder area as to contain her…
I love it whent he leftist cry like little babies when they don’t get their way - and the press writes this article as if completely shocked…
The media and the socialist need to grow up - this isn’t 6th grade anymore…adult US citizens have had enough of glorified hollywood types fromt eh media and other org’s like Move On telling them what’s best for them…
she got exactly what she dished out -
A whole lot more of the commies should be on the ground bleeding…..
She was in disguise and attempted to approach Rand Paul. How would they know her intent? They should have stripped her down to make sure she didn’t have a bomb or gun on her.
Clearly a case of assault with intent… this bitch was a hit bitch from soros. I hope she suffered some sort of permanent damage.
Lets see….she is a liberal so she is already a) Ugly, and 2) brain damaged.
I can’t figure out what more you can do to liberals other than driving a stake through their heart and setting them on fire in the sunlight.
I dont have a problem with this…
I dont F’ing care if the leftists do…
Honestly, Im game for putting any leftist POS who even thinks about acting stupid in the GD hospital.
It is NOT our fault it had to come to this. but it HAS come to this and its our duty to MAKE them understand that its in their best interests to go the F away. We have always been able to put these people down but have shied away from it because we know that once we start to cross that bridge we have to go all the way. We gave up A LOT to avoid this from happening but the F’ers just kept on pushing… Now they have pushed us onto that bridge and we ARE going to cross it. Enough is enough…
Act like a F’ing IDIOT at your own peril.
I’d have shot the b**** and been done with it.
It goes on and on in that vein, for hundreds more comments.
At Hot Air a few people are not down with stomping MoveOn activists, but a lot of them are cheering:
This patchouli wearing, no shaving socialist will be the darling of the morning commie news shows tomorrow. […] Most likely another MoveOn thug in disguise. Let’s see how fast they find him. […] Miss Valle is a professional protestor utilized by Moveon.org, Greenpeace and others. She’s been arrested several times now. She knew rushing Paul would invoke a response by his supporters. Nice that there was a camera RIGHT on the scene to capture this event huh? […] THIS PERSON WAS A CONVICTED FELON WHO WAS CHARGING A SENATE CANDIDATE IN A DISGUISE. […] I still see nothing wrong. Next time this happens and someone doesn’t knock the B*tch out, I’ll probably regret, but i’ll crack a smile when her bomb goes off. […] Sorry to say it, but Our Idiot President’s stupid rhetoric only inflames these people. […] So this protestor who got stomped on was with MoveOn.org? And the problem with this is………..? […] War is he11. And move on dot org declared war on America a long time ago. The beeyotch is a professional agitator. Now if she were run over by a D9, that would be newsworthy. But this? {Tap, tap, tap} Crap, my givead*mn meter’s on the fritz again. […] Who the h*ll knows what was in her hands, after all,she could of been trained,er, educated by Ayers for gawd sakes!!!!
This patchouli wearing, no shaving socialist will be the darling of the morning commie news shows tomorrow.
Most likely another MoveOn thug in disguise. Let’s see how fast they find him.
Miss Valle is a professional protestor utilized by Moveon.org, Greenpeace and others. She’s been arrested several times now. She knew rushing Paul would invoke a response by his supporters. Nice that there was a camera RIGHT on the scene to capture this event huh?
THIS PERSON WAS A CONVICTED FELON WHO WAS CHARGING A SENATE CANDIDATE IN A DISGUISE.
I still see nothing wrong.
Next time this happens and someone doesn’t knock the B*tch out, I’ll probably regret, but i’ll crack a smile when her bomb goes off.
Sorry to say it, but Our Idiot President’s stupid rhetoric only inflames these people.
So this protestor who got stomped on was with MoveOn.org?
And the problem with this is………..?
War is he11. And move on dot org declared war on America a long time ago.
The beeyotch is a professional agitator. Now if she were run over by a D9, that would be newsworthy. But this?
{Tap, tap, tap} Crap, my givead*mn meter’s on the fritz again.
Who the h*ll knows what was in her hands, after all,she could of been trained,er, educated by Ayers for gawd sakes!!!!
There’s more, of course, but I can only handle reading so much rabid vitriol.
you can't handle reading it, so you post that nonsense here so that we can read it?
gee thanks
Where there is no property there is no justice; a proposition as certain as any demonstration in Euclid
Fools! not to see that what they madly desire would be a calamity to them as no hands but their own could bring
The word "Black Flag" operation popped into my mind upon seeing the video. Even if the dude was an insider it is not out out of the question that the desperate folks (I do not know why since Rand Paul is not Libertarian in the slightest bit.) in both major parties are afraid of this election.
As for eliminating progams that help the "underdog", I can not see how any of those government programs help the underdogs. In fact all of them hurt the lower classes. The worst are in order of damage: Medicare-Government sponsored price fixing scheme for health care thus raising the cost, Social Security-System that steals trillions from poor young folks and gives it to rich older ones where the poor younger ones would be much better off investing 15% of their incomes on their own, Minimum Wage-Prevents poor folks (Mainly African-American Men) from competing with higher priced-more skilled union labor, Public Works-Steal precious capital away from job/wealth creating activities that help society, etc
Maybe I am horribly naive but assuming people on both parties are terrified of Rand Paul and willing to do devious underhand things to stop his campaign, why would having someone who is not Rand Paul stomp on a liberals head going to help with that?