Free Capitalist Network - Community Archive
Mises Community Archive
An online community for fans of Austrian economics and libertarianism, featuring forums, user blogs, and more.

The Penny: Should we keep it or not?

rated by 0 users
This post has 18 Replies | 4 Followers

Top 200 Contributor
Posts 391
Points 6,975
Michelangelo Posted: Mon, Apr 2 2012 5:44 PM

Recently Canada has elected to phase out its penny, and there are a few who are trying to get the US to drop its penny as well. Personally I find the penny a useful method of showing how inflation has made our currency so worthless that even our pennies, made of zinc, is too costly to produce. We can't even keep the zinc standard! I'm more than happy to keep producing pennies if only to use it to poke fun at the Feds. 

What does everyone else think? Should we get rid of the penny? 

  • | Post Points: 35
Top 75 Contributor
Posts 1,389
Points 21,840
Moderator

As an owner of a business I would want as much control over my pricing as much as possible.   Would we really start with a unit of .5?  That would piss me off

"As in a kaleidoscope, the constellation of forces operating in the system as a whole is ever changing." - Ludwig Lachmann

"When A Man Dies A World Goes Out of Existence"  - GLS Shackle

  • | Post Points: 20
Top 10 Contributor
Posts 6,953
Points 118,135

Michelangelo:
What does everyone else think? Should we get rid of the penny?

Some guy on Youtube thinks so.

 

 

  • | Post Points: 5
Top 50 Contributor
Male
Posts 2,051
Points 36,080
Bert replied on Mon, Apr 2 2012 6:29 PM

Not just that, but wouldn't the sales tax conflict with all prices ending in 0 or 5?  Even if the list price for something is 5.00 not 4.99, that may be an issue, and I doubt people will be comfortable with the idea of "Oh, it's 5.03, just round it up two cents."

I had always been impressed by the fact that there are a surprising number of individuals who never use their minds if they can avoid it, and an equal number who do use their minds, but in an amazingly stupid way. - Carl Jung, Man and His Symbols
  • | Post Points: 20
Top 75 Contributor
Posts 1,612
Points 29,515

Not just that, but wouldn't the sales tax conflict with all prices ending in 0 or 5?  Even if the list price for something is 5.00 not 4.99, that may be an issue, and I doubt people will be comfortable with the idea of "Oh, it's 5.03, just round it up two cents."

Pretty sure things would get rounded up, yes.  My banking teacher asked if we should get rid of pennies and I suggested we get rid of nickels and dimes too.  We should just use quarters, dollar coins, and fives.  He was like, 'Well we'd have inflation."  The US deserves inflation, anyway.

It costs the gov more to make pennies than we get to pass them around for.  It is illegal for us to melt them down and get a superior value.  Get rid of the damn things...and nickels and dimes too.

"The Fed does not make predictions. It makes forecasts..." - Mustang19
  • | Post Points: 20
Top 10 Contributor
Posts 6,953
Points 118,135

Essentially everything in those two posts was addressed in the video above.  wink

 

  • | Post Points: 5
Top 10 Contributor
Posts 6,953
Points 118,135

And here's one for Canada:

 

 

  • | Post Points: 20
Top 50 Contributor
Male
Posts 2,051
Points 36,080
Bert replied on Mon, Apr 2 2012 8:11 PM

Well I can't load videos. surprise

I had always been impressed by the fact that there are a surprising number of individuals who never use their minds if they can avoid it, and an equal number who do use their minds, but in an amazingly stupid way. - Carl Jung, Man and His Symbols
  • | Post Points: 35
Top 75 Contributor
Posts 1,612
Points 29,515

Oh, well we should not post anything if the almighty JJ has posted a video!?!?!?!

I don't know why anyone posts anything since there are videos all over youtube explaining what everyone thinks!  I'll just go fuck myself!

;)

"The Fed does not make predictions. It makes forecasts..." - Mustang19
  • | Post Points: 20
Top 200 Contributor
Posts 391
Points 6,975

@Bert

Your point of change being rounded up is quickly dealt with in the second video. Essentially things would be rounded to the nearest nickle, so in the long run everyone would presumably pay the same as some purchases were rounded up and others were rounded down. 

Under our current fiat system I can see some of the rationale for getting rid of the penny, but I'm still not completely bought. Even if the value of the penny may be worth less than what I could make in the time needed to make change, I do derive psychic value from having change done. Whose to say I don't the value I receive from getting change isn't as much or greater than the annoyance of those in line behind me? 

For one I enjoy using it to guesstimate how well the cashier knows their math. My family is in the restaurant business and we've noticed that new cashiers just can't make change like their older counterparts. The 'penny test' is a good litmus test is a good way to see if someone is worth hiring by seeing how well they can make change with pennies. 

The first video made a point that I can't fully agree on. It claims that Coinstar is a drain on the economy. I disagree; Coinstar converts money between different forms. I mean, a money changer who converts USD to pound sterling isn't a drain on an economy. They're fulling a needed service in exchanging between currenties. Coinstar does the same, except it converts within the same currency system.

On a related note, has anyone used a one dollar coin recently? I hear they're itching to get rid of it as soon as they can because noone wants to use them. 

  • | Post Points: 20
Top 75 Contributor
Posts 1,612
Points 29,515

"My family is in the restaurant business and we've noticed that new cashiers just can't make change like their older counterparts. The 'penny test' is a good litmus test is a good way to see if someone is worth hiring by seeing how well they can make change with pennies."

What!?!?  My family owned a restaraunt until this last year (they just sold it), but are you telling me waiters et al have trouble counting?  Counting up to the amount paid or couting down with pennies...?

"Under our current fiat system I can see some of the rationale for getting rid of the penny, but I'm still not completely bought."

Ha, excellent pun.

The current system's logical conclusion would be to get rid of cash and coins altogether and to make people use credit cards.  Those pennies can, instead of going into a jar, be paid to the banks for the ability to use your cards!

We should get rid of pennies.  Make the Five dollar bill, the new one and make quarters into fifths. hahahaha

"The Fed does not make predictions. It makes forecasts..." - Mustang19
  • | Post Points: 20
Top 10 Contributor
Posts 6,953
Points 118,135

Aristophanes:
I'll just go fuck myself!

  • | Post Points: 5
Top 200 Contributor
Posts 391
Points 6,975

What!?!?  My family owned a restaraunt until this last year (they just sold it), but are you telling me waiters et al have trouble counting?  Counting up to the amount paid or couting down with pennies..

I'm hoping it's just regional, but in California there is a serious issue with new cashiers knowing how to count. 

As for just getting rid of the paper fiat altogether and just getting on credit cards.. I like to hope that paper is our last defense in the war against inflation. Seeing as they don't need to create physical cash anymore though I suppose it doesn't matter much. If nothing else, physical currency, fiat or not, at least stil allows black markets to function. You can still pay under the table or purchase anonymously. I suppose one could always use a gift credit card for anonymous purchases, but I don't see it being very useful. 

  • | Post Points: 35
Top 10 Contributor
Posts 6,953
Points 118,135

Michelangelo:
I like to hope that paper is our last defense in the war against inflation.

 

  • | Post Points: 5
Top 75 Contributor
Posts 1,612
Points 29,515

"As for just getting rid of the paper fiat altogether and just getting on credit cards.. I like to hope that paper is our last defense in the war against inflation. Seeing as they don't need to create physical cash anymore though I suppose it doesn't matter much. If nothing else, physical currency, fiat or not, at least stil allows black markets to function. You can still pay under the table or purchase anonymously. I suppose one could always use a gift credit card for anonymous purchases, but I don't see it being very useful."

I'm with you.  The Empire will have us using 'credits' before long.  But, once we're in space our inflation can go galactic...and it won't be a problem on Earth. =P  The DHS already has PSAs that label trading silver coins as a 'suspisiocus activity' and refer the viewer to report them.  I'd suspect that in the future some commodities will have to replace cash.

Anonymity doesn't help plan economies.  TPTB are gonna need more and more information, so they are going to want you to use that card system.

"The Fed does not make predictions. It makes forecasts..." - Mustang19
  • | Post Points: 20
Top 50 Contributor
Posts 2,679
Points 45,110
gotlucky replied on Mon, Apr 2 2012 11:34 PM

Aristophanes:

The Empire will have us using 'credits' before long.  But, once we're in space our inflation can go galactic...and it won't be a problem on Earth.

I see what you did there.

  • | Post Points: 20
Top 10 Contributor
Male
Posts 4,987
Points 89,745

Why not make it out of cheaper materials?

  • | Post Points: 20
Top 50 Contributor
Male
Posts 2,493
Points 39,355
Malachi replied on Wed, Apr 4 2012 7:22 PM
Oh you just want to kick the can down the road a ways, dont you, Wheylous? Soon we will have paper pennies. They already give you pogs for change at the exchanges overseas, on us bases. Round carboard pogs with motivational pictures and a denomination.
Keep the faith, Strannix. -Casey Ryback, Under Siege (Steven Seagal)
  • | Post Points: 20
Top 75 Contributor
Posts 1,612
Points 29,515

Our coins are already made out of the cheapest metals we cant make them out of....zinc.  Not copper, not nickel, not silver, but zinc.

@malachi

"Poached eggs....it's like eggs 101, Woodhouse."

"The Fed does not make predictions. It makes forecasts..." - Mustang19
  • | Post Points: 5
Page 1 of 1 (19 items) | RSS