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if not here, where?

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jeff fogel Posted: Tue, Dec 2 2008 9:45 PM

Things are beginning to look bleak here. Margaret Thatcher spoke of the 'rachet effect' with regard to conservatism. In other words, freedom cannot advance; it can only hold its place. To that end, this country seems to be on an ineluctable slide to socialism, with an attendant loss of liberties. So my question is, is there any other place that is any better in terms of freedom? 

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Jeff, we're on the internet, so when you say "here", where exactly do you mean?

"When you're young you worry about people stealing your ideas, when you're old you worry that they won't." - David Friedman
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Bogart replied on Tue, Dec 2 2008 10:18 PM

That is easy: The ex-communist countries of the Pacific Rim are experiencing great gains in freedom.  Given the populations of these countries, more humans are experiencing more freedom than ever before.

As for the West, I think it is not bleak but certainly people are not keeping their current freedoms.  The reasons are the same: 1. Aggressive foreign policy. 2. The economics of Keynes. 3. Large portions of the population are dependent on government. etc.  In other words the old aggressive ideology of Fascism is on the march again.

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Sorry about that. Here, as in USA.

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jeff fogel:

Things are beginning to look bleak here. Margaret Thatcher spoke of the 'rachet effect' with regard to conservatism. In other words, freedom cannot advance; it can only hold its place. To that end, this country seems to be on an ineluctable slide to socialism, with an attendant loss of liberties. So my question is, is there any other place that is any better in terms of freedom? 

I've always been impressed by the economic freedom in Singapore, but unless they permit the ownership of firearms I won't be doing anything other than visiting.

"I cannot prove, but am prepared to affirm, that if you take care of clarity in reasoning, most good causes will take care of themselves, while some bad ones are taken care of as a matter of course." -Anthony de Jasay

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iddqd replied on Fri, Dec 12 2008 9:06 AM

I think they do. http://spf.gov.sg/licence/frameset_AE.html

Sorry for the bump by the way, but I think this thread needs it.

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iddqd:

I think they do. http://spf.gov.sg/licence/frameset_AE.html

Sorry for the bump by the way, but I think this thread needs it.

"Question:  What are the laws regarding gun ownership? Are shooting facilities available and open to the public? Specifically are skeet and sporting clays facilities available? What about private gun/handgun ownership?

Answer:   Gun ownership in Singapore is illegal. There is however a private gun club which provides rifles and ammunition for skeet and trap shooting. Membership costs S$3300 plus S$300 a year."

Source: http://www.expatsingapore.com/content/view/1107

"I cannot prove, but am prepared to affirm, that if you take care of clarity in reasoning, most good causes will take care of themselves, while some bad ones are taken care of as a matter of course." -Anthony de Jasay

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Nick. B replied on Fri, Dec 12 2008 10:03 PM

I've heard of an organisation run by Roderick T. Long called the Molinari Society, hope that helps.

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Singapore is currently our best bet.  Be aware of strict laws about certain freedoms though.  Drugs offenses will get you hanged for example.

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nazgulnarsil:

Singapore is currently our best bet.  Be aware of strict laws about certain freedoms though.  Drugs offenses will get you hanged for example.

I think it is important to note that the harsh penalties (like execution) are for drug trafficking, not drug using. Your main point still stands.

"I cannot prove, but am prepared to affirm, that if you take care of clarity in reasoning, most good causes will take care of themselves, while some bad ones are taken care of as a matter of course." -Anthony de Jasay

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sirmonty replied on Sat, Dec 13 2008 4:00 AM

And they have no qualms about punishing people for utilizing free speech.  Certainly not something friendly to "radicals" like Libertarians....

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iddqd replied on Sat, Dec 13 2008 10:02 PM

I see. Seems like Singapore is a bad choice then. Any other suggestions?

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bigwig replied on Sat, Dec 13 2008 11:08 PM

Does anyone think it would be possible for a few wealthy investors to buy an island or a deserted part of a continent + sovereignty from a poor nation for 50-100m, then sink another 50m for infrastructure and defense and a few businesses that would benefit from being stateless, like elective surgery and other things that have been manipulated to inflated prices?

Or is this just a pipe dream? In a way, it certainly seems simpler (as in less things to go wrong) than agorism.

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bigwig:

Does anyone think it would be possible for a few wealthy investors to buy an island or a deserted part of a continent + sovereignty from a poor nation for 50-100m, then sink another 50m for infrastructure and defense and a few businesses that would benefit from being stateless, like elective surgery and other things that have been manipulated to inflated prices?

Or is this just a pipe dream? In a way, it certainly seems simpler (as in less things to go wrong) than agorism.

Only simply AFTER you have all the money and people.

"I cannot prove, but am prepared to affirm, that if you take care of clarity in reasoning, most good causes will take care of themselves, while some bad ones are taken care of as a matter of course." -Anthony de Jasay

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Been tried. Guess what? The investor was a libertarian.

Republic of Minerva

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic_of_Minerva

Michael Oliver

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Oliver_(real_estate)
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